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Post by parker002 on Oct 5, 2009 9:56:42 GMT -5
Tank Size: 55g Age of the tank: 10 weeks pH: 7.2 Ammonia: 0 NitrAtes: ~20ppm nitrites: 0 GH/KH: KH: ~50ppm GH: ~ 240ppm Temperature: 76F Fish: 1 glo-fish danio 3 white skirt tetras 1 serpae tetra 2 guppies (1 male, 1 female) 2 dwarf platies (1 male, 1 female) 2 lyretail swordtails (1 male, 1 female) 3 platies (1 male, 2 female) 3 julii corys 1 pleco
Symptoms: I first noticed the white stringy feces about a month ago and actually solicited some advice here: everythingaquatic.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=info&action=display&thread=1864
Since that time, I have been "cycling" Jungle Anti-Parasite food (contains metro, prazi, and levamisole) per the directions (3 days of medicated food followed by 4 days of regular food). The fish don't really like it - I've tried garlic juice, fish oil, and water just to soften it. They pick at it but don't really enjoy it or eat it up like they do the flake food.
My 4th and final 3-day cycle of the medicated food starts on Wednesday and as late as this morning, I still saw some white feces floating in the tank. On the upside, the initial infection that I noticed was in the female swordtail and even though she's still suffering from not being able to fully-express her feces (it's still hanging from her about 1" long), it is solid and brown now with no sign of white. The other bad infection was in the female dwarf platy and her feces is also brown now. I'm considering supplementing food with frozen peas to see if that will help them pass their feces more easily.
My question is this - should I repeat the 4-week cycle of the medicated food? Or should I try something different? It does appear the initial infections are clearing up, but the white feces floating in the water indicates to me that one of more of the other fish are also infected.
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Post by bikeguy33 on Oct 5, 2009 11:39:24 GMT -5
i would continue on for at least another half treatment.some infections are further along in some fish than others and require more treatment. keep a close eye out and try to figure out which community member is pooping white and if possible do a treatment in a hospital tank...
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Post by parker002 on Oct 5, 2009 13:02:18 GMT -5
By the way, here's some pics of the swordtail when she first started showing symptoms. They're poor quality overall, but a couple of them are pretty clear. By using the Jungle food, I should be treating pretty much every possibility. The combination of metro, prazi, and levamisole should be effective against protozoans and worms of all kinds. Thoughts?
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Post by Carl on Oct 5, 2009 16:12:08 GMT -5
As bikeguy stated, a hospital tank would be best for treating the sick fish. After looking at your fish, he looks otherwise quite healthy, which tends to make a possible bacterial infection less likely, so continuing on with this treatment, along with some in tank (hospital) a good idea. Consider Metronidazole or Jungle Parasite Clear in the tank, as well as medicated baths with Methylene Blue and Metronidazole in these baths. Carl
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Post by parker002 on Oct 5, 2009 18:23:26 GMT -5
As bikeguy stated, a hospital tank would be best for treating the sick fish. After looking at your fish, he looks otherwise quite healthy, which tends to make a possible bacterial infection less likely, so continuing on with this treatment, along with some in tank (hospital) a good idea. Consider Metronidazole or Jungle Parasite Clear in the tank, as well as medicated baths with Methylene Blue and Metronidazole in these baths. Carl Thanks! I think I'll try the Jungle Parasite Clear since it doesn't require me to remove filtration or anything. Since my fish aren't dying, I'd rather work backwards from the least amount of effort towards the most.
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Post by murdock6701 on Oct 6, 2009 9:13:10 GMT -5
I've kept platys for years and on more than one occasion I have noticed occurances of white stringy poop but I never treated my fish for it not ever lost one as a result - try a little frozen brinre shrimp - words, like platys are pigs when it comes to eating - don't overfeed them
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Post by parker002 on Oct 6, 2009 10:09:05 GMT -5
I've kept platys for years and on more than one occasion I have noticed occurances of white stringy poop but I never treated my fish for it not ever lost one as a result - try a little frozen brinre shrimp - words, like platys are pigs when it comes to eating - don't overfeed them Yeah I feed flake once a day, one pinch so that none is remaining. I also buy a protein-based flake and a spirulina flake and mix them together.
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Post by murdock6701 on Oct 6, 2009 11:30:25 GMT -5
I feed twice a day but only as much as they can eat in 2-3 minutes
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Post by parker002 on Oct 6, 2009 12:51:17 GMT -5
I feed twice a day but only as much as they can eat in 2-3 minutes Am I underfeeding then? Last weekend for example, I didn't feed them Saturday morning because I was busy - since I feed them once a day, I didn't figure it was a big deal to vary by 12 hours or so. I got home about 11pm on Saturday and one of the guppies had been munched and was missing part of his tail.
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Post by murdock6701 on Oct 6, 2009 14:01:54 GMT -5
I guess it really depends on what you're feeding them - the fish you mentioned as being in your tank are not overly aggressive so I'm wondering if perhaps you're not feeding them enough - anyone else care to commment here?
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Post by goldenpuon on Oct 6, 2009 14:23:13 GMT -5
Are the fish skinny looking at all? I didn't feed my goldfish enough for a long time and never understood why they barely made my tank dirty. On closer inspection, most of them were underweight and I was underfeeding.
I don't own platies but I do own guppies- a close relative. I feed mine twice a day.
I'm not sure if this helps but maybe it could give you some perspective on how much to feed if you are not feeding enough.
The injury of your fish's tail sounds like it could be from fin rot, something in the tank tore his/her fin, or maybe another fish attacked it? I read that serpae tetras can be agressive. Maybe one of them took a nibble at it? I'd need a picture to be more sure.
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Post by parker002 on Oct 6, 2009 14:25:48 GMT -5
I guess it really depends on what you're feeding them - the fish you mentioned as being in your tank are not overly aggressive so I'm wondering if perhaps you're not feeding them enough - anyone else care to commment here? Now that I think about it, I started the medicated food on a Wednesday and it's a 3-day cycle. The third day of the cycle would have been Friday and the guppy got nipped between sometime before midnight Saturday/Sunday. I usually feed them around 9pm at night, so I really didn't exceed my normal 24-hour interval by more than 3 or 4 hours. However, as I stated before, the fish don't eat the medicated food all that well. So they were probably more hungry than normal. Furthermore, of any of my fish, the tetras are probably the most inclined to nip or be aggressive. They're also the LEAST interested in eating the medicated food. It's entirely possible that I just created a convergence of issues...
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Post by parker002 on Oct 6, 2009 14:30:24 GMT -5
Are the fish skinny looking at all? I didn't feed my goldfish enough for a long time and never understood why they barely made my tank dirty. On closer inspection, most of them were underweight and I was underfeeding. I don't own platies but I do own guppies- a close relative. I feed mine twice a day. I'm not sure if this helps but maybe it could give you some perspective on how much to feed if you are not feeding enough. The injury of your fish's tail sounds like it could be from fin rot, something in the tank tore his/her fin, or maybe another fish attacked it? I read that serpae tetras can be agressive. Maybe one of them took a nibble at it? I'd need a picture to be more sure. No, they're not skinny. The female dwarf platy is actually quite plump and the two female platies are round as well. I'm almost certain the fin damage is not an infection - I put him in a breeder net to isolate him and his tail began growing back immediately with no other treatment. It's been 10 days and it's almost completely restored. Yes, the serpae tetra is somewhat aggressive - we "rescued" him and aren't really sure how he survived. When we found him, the water was about 3" deep, the color of sun tea, and there was no filtration. (The owner's other fish had died and they were unaware of the tetra still being in the tank). However, he sits in one corner of the tank and RARELY ever leaves, even to eat. He waits for the food to float to him. So while I say he is aggressive, it's more territorialism. He doesn't ever chase the other fish or attack them unless they enter his "space".
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Post by Carl on Oct 6, 2009 15:42:48 GMT -5
I guess it really depends on what you're feeding them - the fish you mentioned as being in your tank are not overly aggressive so I'm wondering if perhaps you're not feeding them enough - anyone else care to comment here? Sorry I did not comment earlier, I simply felt I sometimes jump in too early before others give useful comments. As well, I concur with what has been said. The problem with most medicated foods (as I use and sell them too) is that often the fish will refuse to eat the medicated food. I try soaking these foods in fish oil or flax seed oil to make it more palatable. Your Sword looked quite healthy as I noted earlier, which is why murdocks comment: "I've kept platys for years and on more than one occasion I have noticed occurrences of white stringy poop but I never treated my fish for it not ever lost one as a result " was well taken. Besides serpae tetras, I have found Swordtails to be more aggressive than guppies, along with this, your Sword may have also been rather hungry too, adding to potential aggression. For this reason bikeguy's suggestion of a hospital tank is an good idea. Soaking Brine Shrimp in Metronidazole may be a good way of administering internal medication. Carl
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Post by parker002 on Oct 6, 2009 15:57:24 GMT -5
I guess it really depends on what you're feeding them - the fish you mentioned as being in your tank are not overly aggressive so I'm wondering if perhaps you're not feeding them enough - anyone else care to comment here? Sorry I did not comment earlier, I simply felt I sometimes jump in too early before others give useful comments. As well, I concur with what has been said. The problem with most medicated foods (as I use and sell them too) is that often the fish will refuse to eat the medicated food. I try soaking these foods in fish oil or flax seed oil to make it more palatable. Your Sword looked quite healthy as I noted earlier, which is why murdocks comment: "I've kept platys for years and on more than one occasion I have noticed occurrences of white stringy poop but I never treated my fish for it not ever lost one as a result " was well taken. Besides serpae tetras, I have found Swordtails to be more aggressive than guppies, along with this, your Sword may have also been rather hungry too, adding to potential aggression. For this reason bikeguy's suggestion of a hospital tank is an good idea. Soaking Brine Shrimp in Metronidazole may be a good way of administering internal medication. Carl I tried soaking in fish oil - the pellets are so hard that even after crushing them, they failed to absorb any of the oil and it all ended up in a slick on the surface. I will try the shrimp. Is metro effective for other parasites? I figured broader spectrum was better since I don't really know what the issue is.
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Post by Carl on Oct 6, 2009 16:10:22 GMT -5
Did you soak the pellets in water prior to adding the oil to soften them? Usually enough oil clings to the pleets to enhance the flavor, however if the fish still show lack of interest, I would give up on this idea I suggested.
The oil slick is easily removed with a few paper towels.
Metronidazole is effective for several single cell and a few multi cell parasites, however it is not the strongest medication for all.
I agree with your thoughts as to using a more broad spectrum medicated food, however often getting this food (as you have found) is quite the chore.
Adding the Parasite Clear to a hospital tank may be the way to go; as well medicated baths are often quite effective, as medications are often absorbed much better this way (including Methylene Blue). I strongly recommend a bath, especially since they are not intrusive to aquarium parameters & are often effective for just this sort of problem
The other thought is do simply observe your fish and do nothing as already noted by murdock
Carl
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Post by fishfever on Oct 6, 2009 17:09:18 GMT -5
I generally notice stringy poop from platys or mollies when they overeat (which is every time they are overfed!). The color seems to match somewhat to what they ate; for example if zuchinni it is whitish; if bloodworms it can be redish. I also note that this doesn't seem to cause any problems and we generally just cut back on feeding to reduce this.
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Post by parker002 on Oct 7, 2009 11:07:23 GMT -5
Did you soak the pellets in water prior to adding the oil to soften them? Usually enough oil clings to the pleets to enhance the flavor, however if the fish still show lack of interest, I would give up on this idea I suggested. Here is what I tried, in order: 1) Fed whole pellets. Fish repeatedly picked at them but never really ate them. 2) Crushed pellets with rolling pin and fed them like that. Again, fish mouthed the food but never really ate well. 3) Crushed some fresh garlic and mixed with distilled water. Removed garlic solids and soaked whole pellets in the water/juice. No change in behavior. 4) Crushed the pellets and soaked them in the garlic water/juice. Still no change. 5) Tried soaking whole pellets in just fish oil. It was obvious after trying the garlic water and the regular water that the pellets weren't soaking up the oil - there was a change in appearance with water (color lightened, texture softened, pellets increased in size). So I crushed some pellets and tried soaking them but they it just emulsified like the pellets. I fed the crushed pellets to the fish, but eating behavior again didn't change. 6) I made a guess that it wasn't a taste thing with the fish but rather that maybe the pellets were just too hard, at least with the livebearers. The tetras were ignoring the pellets after the first bite in all of the above steps, but the livebearers would bite repeatedly but just never actually eat. This time I soaked the pellets in distilled water for several hours until soft. I made sure to use just enough water to make them soft but not dilute the medication (no water left in container after removing pellets). Still, the fish pick and pick but don't really eat. I do know they're eating SOME of it, because vacuuming the gravel doesn't produce a lot of leftover pellets. The oil slick is easily removed with a few paper towels. I had no problems removing the oil using your previous instructions. Thanks! Adding the Parasite Clear to a hospital tank may be the way to go; as well medicated baths are often quite effective, as medications are often absorbed much better this way (including Methylene Blue). I strongly recommend a bath, especially since they are not intrusive to aquarium parameters & are often effective for just this sort of problem. This is my current Plan B. The other thought is do simply observe your fish and do nothing as already noted by murdock. This is my current Plan A. Thanks all for your help!
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Post by parker002 on Oct 7, 2009 11:08:43 GMT -5
I generally notice stringy poop from platys or mollies when they overeat (which is every time they are overfed!). The color seems to match somewhat to what they ate; for example if zuchinni it is whitish; if bloodworms it can be redish. I also note that this doesn't seem to cause any problems and we generally just cut back on feeding to reduce this. Great info. If you look at the pics above, you'll notice some pinkish-red material in the feces. That is flake food. It has to be, since it's that color BEFORE they eat it. As indicated in my previous post, I'm going to finish the current treatment and then do nothing. My fish seem happy and healthy.
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Post by murdock6701 on Oct 7, 2009 14:43:51 GMT -5
good call and good luck!
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