|
|
Post by foxtrap99 on Jan 21, 2009 15:16:15 GMT -5
I have a 3" Rainbow Cichlid (Herotilapia multispinosa) and about 36 hours ago he attempted to swallow one of my Otocinclus Catfish (Otocinclus vestitus). I say "attempted" because the Otto is still stuck in his throat with only a small portion of the tail sticking out. I left the situation alone overnight, hoping he could either fully swallow or spit out the now dead Otto. Unfortunately it is still stuck, now in the second day. I did catch the Rainbow Cichlid and unsuccessfully attempted to gently remove the Otto with a pair of tweezers. Other than unable to now eat, the fish does not appear to be in too much stress yet - however he is much less active than before.
Anyone have any suggestions? Do you think there is any hope?
Thanks,
Craig
|
|
|
|
Post by Suzie Q (Lori) on Jan 21, 2009 15:21:11 GMT -5
My suggestion is to take a pair of small scissors and gently cut the Otto's barbs to remove the fish...this is easier said then done...or use the scissors and cut the otto apart until it comes out.
Good luck!!!
Lori
|
|
|
|
Post by Carl on Jan 21, 2009 15:49:40 GMT -5
This is unusual behavior for a Rainbow Cichlid, but this does not matter at this point.
I think Suzie Q gave a good suggestion, otherwise the only thought I have is to simply give him more time.
I had this happen more times than I would like with Saltwater Lionfish, and considering the fact they are poisonous, I would not want to handle the fish.
4 times out of 5 times, time would take care of the problem.
Carl
|
|
|
|
Post by jonv on Jan 21, 2009 17:01:38 GMT -5
I do not really know what to suggest in terms of removal or damage done at this point. I've never had this occur before. What I agree with Carl is this is a highly unusual situation. www.cichlid-forum.com/profiles/species.php?id=91All indicators point to this not being a carnivorous species. The food aspect, not being able to eat really isn't something that should lead to death or damage unless this starts to go into a week or more. But you probably have a higher risk of an infection being caused from internal damage done by anything of the Oto being stuck into the flesh part of the mouth and throat. I'd assume that your water change routine is pretty solid here and you are keeping the parameters in the tank pretty well maintained. This will help reduce the risk of secondary damage done by any pathogens. You might want to see if this can pass in a few days or so also. It's not a bad idea to try to remove any barbs stuck in the fish, but this might prove to be very challenging. Again as lack of food is unlikely to cause any significant harm, trying to see if the Rainbow can break down the body or chew it up might be worth the time. Are there any other tank mates and what sized tank are we looking at? Tank mates in there, especially if this is a male, could lead into other problems, especially among aggression and stress that might occur if any tank mates sense something isn't right with the Rainbow. While I really don't have much I can say about removing lodged fish parts, I'm trying to assist in terms of preventing secondary damage. |
|
|
|
Post by bikeguy33 on Jan 21, 2009 19:44:22 GMT -5
hmmmm....quite the predicament. first off....if you have a hospital tank i would pull the rainbow out. jon had a good point on tankmate aggression. if the otto is stuck badly....perhaps a mild tand seditive will help relax the jaws enough to carefully remove yesterdays lunch....but this is only if you have some kind of isolation tank. as to what setitive, i am not sure. carl may know of a common one that could work.
also....and i hope i`m not being to gross....the longer the otto is dead the softer he will become and easier for the cichlid to swallow.so carls original idea of waiting is not a bad one...
|
|
|
|
Post by foxtrap99 on Jan 21, 2009 19:58:03 GMT -5
I very much appreciate all the advice. I also agree this is highly unusual as everything I have read about this fish, I would not have expected this behaviour. I feed every day so it was not a case of the fish being overly hungry. It maybe possible that the Otto was already dead and he was just being opportunistic!
In terms of trying to remove with a small pair of scissors - I think this will be very difficult as indicated and I think I will wait a little longer as others suggested. Right now the fish does not appear to be in a lot of distress and I fear trying to force this out again might make things worse at this point.
My water parameters are excellent - I do regular water/filter changes and water tests - all are great! In terms of other fish in the tank, my Rainbow cichlid is the biggest and usually the boss! but he is not aggressive. There is another smaller Rainbow cichlid in the tank, 2 small Umbrella Cichlid (Apistogramma borellii), a few barbs (tiger, rosy, cherry, checker), a Clown Pleco and one remaining Otto. The tank is 33 gallons.
I do have other tanks but unfortunately all are in use so it is not practical to try and isolate as suggested. I have been considering converting my smaller 20 gallon to an hospital tank - it would really come in handy right now. Good point on that the Otto might become soft and easier to dislodge - since I assume the fish will go quite some time without eating, I will keep my fingers crossed that this happens. I agree with jonv that the biggest immediate threat might be secondary infection, especially since the poor guy is unable to close his mouth. Will post an update later - hopefully some good news as I really like this fish. Thanks again to everyone for your advice.
Craig
|
|
|
|
Post by jonv on Jan 21, 2009 20:03:17 GMT -5
Anytime Craig. Keep an eye on those Tiger Barbs though ok? They are notorious fin nippers which raises stress levels. Higher stress levels weaken immune systems, so that while the injuries of the oto being in there wouldn't kill the Rainbow outright, secondary infections can do a number on the Rainbow from a weakend immune system.
|
|
|
|
Post by foxtrap99 on Jan 23, 2009 11:35:33 GMT -5
GOOD NEWS! My Rainbow Cichlid was able to get rid of the Otto - not sure if he eventually swallowed it or managed to spit it out, but it is gone this morning and that is the main thing. I just fed the fish and he appears to be eating normally - he is also the most hungry since he has not been able to eat in the past 3 days.
Want to say thanks again to all of you for showing your concern and of course for your advice. Everyone have a great weekend!
Craig
|
|
|
|
Post by Carl on Jan 23, 2009 11:51:40 GMT -5
GOOD NEWS! My Rainbow Cichlid was able to get rid of the Otto - not sure if he eventually swallowed it or managed to spit it out, but it is gone this morning and that is the main thing. I just fed the fish and he appears to be eating normally - he is also the most hungry since he has not been able to eat in the past 3 days. Want to say thanks again to all of you for showing your concern and of course for your advice. Everyone have a great weekend! Craig Glad to read this!  It looks like he will be fine, just keep an eye on him. Carl |
|
|
|
Post by goldenpuon on Jan 23, 2009 16:51:49 GMT -5
That's good to hear. Make sure he is nipping or trying to eat anyone else. Good luck!
|
|
|
|
Post by Suzie Q (Lori) on Jan 24, 2009 9:32:33 GMT -5
Great news indeed!!!!
|
|
|
|
Post by kagome on Jan 24, 2009 10:25:41 GMT -5
I'm so glad to read that this turned out OK. It's bad enough to lose one fish over this, but two would be much worse. Hopefully the rainbow cichlid has learned his lesson and will now learn to avoid spiky tank mates! lol
|
|
|
|
Post by eve on Jan 24, 2009 14:35:20 GMT -5
That's really great  |
|
|
|
Post by murdock6701 on Jan 24, 2009 15:33:11 GMT -5
sorry I never posted on this thead but just wanted to offer my congrats as to how the situation remedied itself - lucky guy! glad all worked out well
|
|
