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Post by parker002 on Nov 8, 2009 17:22:51 GMT -5
So when we first started the 10 gallon aquarium last year sometime, my wife went to a LFS store and bought some "platies". For any of you that have been helping me the last couple of months, you've seen my list of fish. However, in the course of adding fish the last couple of days and looking at dozens of fish species, I think my wife was duped. I'm worried that, at worst, I may have an incompatible mix of fish. At best, I may have stocked my tank with females of a species that won't alleviate my breeder imbalance. First, I've mentioned on here that I have a male and female "dwarf platy" pair. I'm now pretty sure they are balloon mollies, but I'm not sure. Here they are:   Second, she was sold two "swordtails". This one is not as big a deal, because they appear to actually be LYRETAIL swordtails. My concern here is aggression, both by the swordtails and against them (because of their fins).   Finally, I'm also pretty sure that the "regular platies" she was sold are actually mollies - I have one male and one female left from the original purchase. Also, the one and only fish to have been born in my tank and survived is also in this group - she was born from one of the orange "platies" my wife bought, so I just assumed she was a platy. Here they are:      So first, can anybody ID my fish? Am I correct in believing they're mollies? Secondly, do I have anything to be worried about? I added 4 mickey mouse platies to the tank yesterday, ALL female. So if all of these fish are mollies, I don't have ANY male platies at all. Will I have problems with aggressive behavior, or do mollies do well with other livebearers? I added a male betta as well but he seems to be doing well so far. |
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Post by Carl on Nov 8, 2009 19:45:32 GMT -5
Your last set of pictures are definitely Mollies (Genus Poecilia, the same genus as Guppies) The first two still look like Platties, even though they have the Balloon Molly appearance, these still have more the shape of livebearers from the genus Xiphophorus which includes Swords and Platties; however I am less sure of these than I am the fish in your last pics. As to swordtails, these can be more aggressive as from my experience, as well the longer fins can also be targets of fast moving fish such as some Tetras, although this aspect of Swords has been less a problem for me. See: Livebearers ProfilesCarl |
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Post by fishfever on Nov 8, 2009 20:06:25 GMT -5
I'm pretty sure from the dorsal fin shape/size that the first two are platys... either pregnant or in need of going on a diet. ;-) I can't see the anal fin too well for the one on the right but if it is pointy instead of a triangle (which it kind of looks like) it would be the male in the pair.
It's very common to get sold something that is listed as something else from many LFS's since alot of the folks that work there aren't fish experts and fish tend to somehow find their way into neighboring tanks...
Mollies and platys are generally both very peaceful fish get along fine with each other and other fish. More likely they would be the targets of more aggressive fish in your tank.
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Post by parker002 on Nov 8, 2009 22:30:26 GMT -5
The first two still look like Platties, even though they have the Balloon Molly appearance, these still have more the shape of livebearers from the genus Xiphophorus which includes Swords and Platties; however I am less sure of these than I am the fish in your last pics. Interesting. Because the male (the MUCH smaller of the two) looks EXACTLY like the balloon mollies we looked at today - he has the dip on his nose and everything. I agree on the female, though. Other than the fact that she's huge and round, she looks more like a platy. As to swordtails, these can be more aggressive as from my experience, as well the longer fins can also be targets of fast moving fish such as some Tetras, although this aspect of Swords has been less a problem for me. So are they definitely lyretails? The female can be aggressive at times, but the male is COMPLETELY timid. He's pretty laid-back. As for them getting nipped, we've had them since we got the 10-gallon tank, so they've been with the serpae tetra for about 18 months or so, and despite his territorial nature, he never nipped them. We've had the white skirt tetras since we got the 55g (2 months now maybe?) and they haven't nipped the swordtails either. I'm pretty sure from the dorsal fin shape/size that the first two are platys... either pregnant or in need of going on a diet. ;-) Yeah, she's LARGE. If she's pregnant, she's been so ever since we got her, because she's always been shaped like that - again, like 18 months. I can't see the anal fin too well for the one on the right but if it is pointy instead of a triangle (which it kind of looks like) it would be the male in the pair. Yeah, he's definitely a male. That's one of the things I actually have learned. And boy does that make picking out fish easier at the store.  It's very common to get sold something that is listed as something else from many LFS's since alot of the folks that work there aren't fish experts and fish tend to somehow find their way into neighboring tanks... Yeah, I'm not mad or anything. It happens. Plus, she reminded me she bought them at one of the big-box stores (Petco, Petsmart, etc.) Mollies and platys are generally both very peaceful fish get along fine with each other and other fish. More likely they would be the targets of more aggressive fish in your tank. They're doing great together, but I do think I might get some female mollies - the males just aren't interested in the mickey mouse platies at all. This is really my main concern. I've kind of gone to the "next level" with this aquarium thing - I know I can keep fish and not kill them. Now I want to make sure they are HAPPY. Like I said, we haven't had any problems with the tetras to date, and the betta is getting along well too (it's only been 36 hours, knock on wood). We'll keep an eye on them and make sure we don't have problems, but I feel pretty good about this part right now. |
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Post by Carl on Nov 9, 2009 10:41:03 GMT -5
So are they definitely lyretails? The female can be aggressive at times, but the male is COMPLETELY timid. He's pretty laid-back. As for them getting nipped, we've had them since we got the 10-gallon tank, so they've been with the serpae tetra for about 18 months or so, and despite his territorial nature, he never nipped them. We've had the white skirt tetras since we got the 55g (2 months now maybe?) and they haven't nipped the swordtails either. Yes, these appear to be lyretail swords, nice ones too IMO  Carl |
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Post by parker002 on Nov 9, 2009 12:36:35 GMT -5
Well, I'm pleased to report that I took an inventory this morning and they appear to be healthy and happy. None have died or disappeared, so so far so good.
I think I will eventually add more female mollies and a male platy to balance things out.
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Post by babygeige on Nov 9, 2009 20:02:25 GMT -5
I had a fish that looked a lot like the fish in your first pictures, only mine was shorter and stubbier. That makes me think that yours might be a balloon molly. I've never seen a wag ballon molly, so I maybe mine was a balloon molly/platy hybrid. I don't know if they can cross breed, but that's what I thought she looked like.  I named her Polly, Platy+Molly. Or maybe yours is a cross too...? I bet yours is pregnant though. She looks way chubbier than mine. |
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Post by Carl on Nov 10, 2009 10:34:37 GMT -5
The best way I can tell you to differentiate between a Molly and Platy is the lips/mouth.
The Genus Poecilia (which includes Mollies and Guppies) have lips/mouth that is more upward (with a generally slightly more pointed mouth as well), while the Genus Xiphophorus (Platties, Swords) has a more forward mouth/lips.
I personally could not make a definite ID from your Platy/Molly pic, however babygeige has a point, although generally extra genus breeding is not possible.
Carl
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Post by parker002 on Nov 10, 2009 11:22:42 GMT -5
The best way I can tell you to differentiate between a Molly and Platy is the lips/mouth. The Genus Poecilia (which includes Mollies and Guppies) have lips/mouth that is more upward (with a generally slightly more pointed mouth as well), while the Genus Xiphophorus (Platties, Swords) has a more forward mouth/lips. I personally could not make a definite ID from your Platy/Molly pic, however babygeige has a point, although generally extra genus breeding is not possible. Carl The mouth is what I noticed too - the mollies have a wide, upward-pointing mouth, almost like a duck bill or something. The true platies I have - the mickeys - have more of what I think of as a traditional fish mouth like a bluegill or a bass. I'm gonna check those fish tonight and see what they have. |
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Post by Suzie Q (Lori) on Nov 18, 2009 15:55:20 GMT -5
My Opinion:
Pictures 1 and 2 look like Platies (granted the first one does look like a Platy/Molly cross or a VERY bloated girl!!!) with a snakeskin guppy thrown in? LOL
Pictures 3 and 4 look like lyretailed Swords
Picture 5 looks like a black marble molly, Picture 6 looks like a marble molly also just not as much black
Picture 9 looks like a Sailfin Molly
Lori
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Post by parker002 on Nov 23, 2009 12:18:59 GMT -5
The first 2 pictures are still the ones I can't figure out.
Looking at the male (best viewed in #2), he absolutely has the upward-pointing mouth and looks nearly identical to the female balloon molly we have in every way except the lips. His mouth isn't as wide as the molly but wider than the other platies. The mollies almost have lips like a camel or other hoofed mammel - they can stick them out and grab food and stuff. The platies don't have mouths like that. The male in that picture has a mouth that looks like a molly when it's closed, but when he opens it, it doesn't look like a molly at all.
The female is even more vague. Her head and lips look even less like a molly - the only thing about her really is her shape. She's been like that since the day we got her - she doesn't seem "fat" just round.
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Post by fishfever on Nov 23, 2009 17:22:48 GMT -5
My vote remains platy for the first two... I had two platys (we have since given them away) that had a very similar shape to yours although the section between the dorsal fin and mouth was straight, not curved downward. I didn't realize the thing with the mouth but after comparing our platys and mollies that is definitely another distinguishing feature. From my brief experience with platys/mollies the dorsal fin on our platys are shorter (lengthwise) and greater height like yours. Our mollies all have longer (lengthwise) and lower height dorsal fins. I don't know if it's possible to get a molly/platy cross (even though this sort of looks like a cross) but when we had males of both species they only showed interest within their own species.
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Post by Carl on Nov 23, 2009 18:56:17 GMT -5
My vote remains platy for the first two... I had two platys (we have since given them away) that had a very similar shape to yours although the section between the dorsal fin and mouth was straight, not curved downward. I didn't realize the thing with the mouth but after comparing our platys and mollies that is definitely another distinguishing feature. From my brief experience with platys/mollies the dorsal fin on our platys are shorter (lengthwise) and greater height like yours. Our mollies all have longer (lengthwise) and lower height dorsal fins. I don't know if it's possible to get a molly/platy cross (even though this sort of looks like a cross) but when we had males of both species they only showed interest within their own species. This is also my vote. My thought is that the male is an abnormality that appears to be more from the genus Poecilia (which includes Guppies), but is still from the genus Xiphophorus (platties, swords). The fact the female appears more from the genus Xiphophorus is part of why I have this opinion. As well i should note that from my understanding of biology, cross genus breeding is possible, but cross family breeding is not (this is assuming that the fish are properly categorized) Carl |
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Post by parker002 on Nov 24, 2009 10:12:57 GMT -5
As well i should note that from my understanding of biology, cross genus breeding is possible, but cross family breeding is not (this is assuming that the fish are properly categorized) Yep, my recollection is the same. I seem to remember that cross-genus breeding is even pretty rare. I don't know if it's possible to get a molly/platy cross (even though this sort of looks like a cross) but when we had males of both species they only showed interest within their own species. Yeah, I was going to go there (mating behavior) next. My thought is that the male is an abnormality that appears to be more from the genus Poecilia (which includes Guppies), but is still from the genus Xiphophorus (platties, swords). The fact the female appears more from the genus Xiphophorus is part of why I have this opinion. It's interesting you bring this up. As fishfever suggested, fish in general seem to try to mate with their "own kind" as much as possible. The male "dwarf platy", when he's not chasing the female "dwarf platy", is trying to mate with the mickey mouse platies. And as I've mentioned in other posts, the lone male guppy in the tank tries to mate with the female "dwarf platy" exclusively. Does that add any insight into what they might be? |
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Post by Carl on Nov 24, 2009 17:03:33 GMT -5
The male "dwarf platy", when he's not chasing the female "dwarf platy", is trying to mate with the mickey mouse platies. And as I've mentioned in other posts, the lone male guppy in the tank tries to mate with the female "dwarf platy" exclusively. Does that add any insight into what they might be? Yes and no (sorry to be vague). Certainly a male Guppy from the Genus Poecilia chasing a Platy (which if a true Play is from the Genus Xiphophorus) adds credibility to this female actually being from the Genus Poecilia, it is not proof either. The reason I say this is that I have seen other fish specifically Tetras that are clearly from a different Genus attempting to mate with each other. Until it succesfully mates with this guppy (which I doubt IMO), this will remain a grey area of opinion. Carl |
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Post by parker002 on Nov 25, 2009 14:13:08 GMT -5
Yep, it's all speculation. Doesn't make it any less fun. |
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