Columnaris in platy?

[fishfever]

Tank Size: 26g
Age of the tank: 5 months
pH: 7.2
Ammonia: 0 ppm
NitrAtes: 30 ppm
nitrites: 0.125 ppm
GH/KH: 300/800 ppm
Temperature: 79
Fish:

1 adult platy
6 juvenile platys
2 adult mollies
4 baby mollies
3 cora catfish
7 tetras

Symptoms:

Our adult platy (the one who has been pregnant 4 times and had the constipation previously) seems to have this fleshy/whitish patch behind her head. It's almost as if her outer skin is being eaten away/peeling away here. There are also smaller patches on her right and underside of her mouth but the main patch is easily visible from above:

i558.photobucket.com/albums/ss25/fishfever/Fleshywhitishpatchindarkareaonplaty.jpg

i558.photobucket.com/albums/ss25/fishfever/Fleshywhitishpatchindarkareaonpl-1.jpg

i558.photobucket.com/albums/ss25/fishfever/Fleshywhitishpatchindarkareaonpl-2.jpg

After reading Carl's disease section -

americanaquariumproducts.com/Columnaris.html

I believe this may be Columnaris. About a week or more ago she started getting this blackish darkness in the same area. I thought it could have been an age spot or something so I ignored it. But yesterday I noticed the fleshy whitish patch.

The reason I think it might be Columnaris is that we have high aeration and water flow in this tank. The article also says that the infection could be blackish which is what I first noticed a while back. I gave her an MB/salt bath last night before trying to determine what this is. This morning I gave her a mild PP/salt bath (never used PP before so I kept the solution dilute this time). I also added several tablespoons more salt to the main tank this morning and dropped the temperature to as low as the heater will go (will likely stabilize in mid 70's). Right now I'm keeping the platy with the rest of the fish and attempting to treat the whole tank (and giving her twice daily PP baths) instead of isolating her. If I have to go with more advanced treatment I'm thinking of doing it in a hospital tank. I have Furan2, Kanamycin and Triple Sulfa at my disposal as well as medicated Wonder shells.

If anyone thinks this is something else please let me know. Until then I'm treating this like a case of Columnaris.

[Carl]

This definitely appears to be Columnaris, although positive identification is often difficult for Columnaris (out side of microscopic examination).

I do need to clarify (in case I worded poorly in this article), that high aeration/water flow is not a necessarily trigger for Columnaris, only a way of ruling out diseases such as Aeromonas, Strep., etc since Columnaris does well in high oxygen water being an aerobic bacterium unlike many other pathogens.

I think your treatment regimen to this point has been great (as usual I might add). The potassium permanganate in particular is excellent at oxidizing external patches of Columnaris.

As for in tank treatments;
Medicated Wonder Shells are not generally a good choice for Columnaris. For mild infections Pimafix can help (along with your baths), the next step up would be Triple Sulfa, with Minocycline, next, then Nitrofurazon (Furan 2) combined with Kanamycin being the strongest.
Personally considering an otherwise healthy aquatic community, I would stay with the baths (with some direct application of Methylene Blue to the area of infection, but not mixed with PP). You can try increasing PP strength as well.
In the tank I would try either Pimafix or Triple Sulfa with the stronger meds on standby (water change and carbon first if they need be used)

Carl

[fishfever]

Thanks Carl. I'm continuing the twice a day PP/salt baths and after I finish one of the baths, I am swabbing the patchy area with MB before returning her to the tank. To make it easier and more repeatable, I've mixed a batch of tank water with PP and salt in a 2 quart bottle ahead of time. Then I just pour (after shaking) the mixture into the small bath container, setting it in the tank for a while to equalize temperatures. I'm hoping there isn't a problem pre-mixing the solution and letting it sit at room temperature until needed. For the small bath container it's difficult to get a precise amount of PP since it's such a small fraction of a teaspoon so pre-mixing a larger amount makes me get the percentage more consistent.

[Carl]

Pre-mixing is a great idea as long as the temperature is equalized.

I have done this in larger batches and then bagged it into several double bagged fish bags and then floated these bags in the aquarium.
The reason I double bagged is a I had a few incidences of the bags leaking or permeating the sides into the aquarium.

Good luck with continued treatment!

Carl

[fishfever]

I think there might be a wee bit of improvement but certainly not getting worse. I think I'm going to try adding Pimafix in the tank as well. I've heard of combining Pimafix and Melafix but not sure if this would help more in this case (although I do have a tetra with a small "love bite" on one of his fins so I was going to use Melafix anyway to speed recovery).

I wish I had thought to buy some Pimafix on my last order from your store Carl as the LFS prices (for ones that even have it) are so much higher. I'm having to pay almost as much for the little 4 oz bottle for what I'd have to pay for your 16 oz! It took about 15-20 minutes of calling around and as usual it seems most have never heard of the product. Reminds me of when I was shopping around for MB. I would get responses like "never heard of it" or "I think you need a prescription for that". LOL

Hey that's another great idea for floating the double-bagged fish bags. No waiting, just net the fish and drop them in with the mixture and temperature all set. I think I'm going to ask the LFS for a dozen bags when I pick up the Pimafix tonight.

[Carl]

Combining Melafix is perfectly safe as they compliment each other.

Melafix likely will do little for any Columnaris infection (assuming we are correct in this diagnosis), but certainly can help with potential secondary gram positive infections, and the "love bite" is certainly a problem that Melafix can help with.

Please keep in mind that both are mild in tank treatments, but hopefully stronger meds will not be needed.

Carl

[fishfever]

I've been doing the PP/salt bath twice a day with one application of MB directly to the fleshy/white patch (right after one of the baths) for almost a week now. The patch seems to be closing up slowly and is probably about half the size it started at so it seems to be working. I'm also adding one dose of Pimafix and Melafix daily (Melafix is unrelated but is to help a male tetra that got a small "love bite" from a female tetra). So I plan to keep this up for a while without going to stronger meds since there is noticeable improvement.

Fortunately platys are generally easy to catch (well there is this one time it wasn't but I'll save that story for another time) so once the bath is prepared it takes about a minute to get her in the bath. I am premixing the salt solution (using tank water) to save time but now adding PP with a dropper just before the bath starts because it seems to react somewhat with the tank water and lose a bit of it's pinkish color after many hours. I believe it is removing some of the dissolved organic compounds so it may lose some strength if allowed to sit with tank water (not too sure but maybe Carl can verify).

[babygeige]

I'm glad to see that the treatments are working! Good luck!