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Post by fishfever on Jun 1, 2009 22:05:01 GMT -5
I have two adult female platys who have had four pregnancies each that I can recall (my count may be off some, probably on the low side). None of these were planned and the males were removed months ago. One of them just had a couple of fry a few days ago. I didn't each know she was carrying them because she wasn't bulging at all. The other one was bulging quite a bit and she started having the fry today so we put her in a breeding cage within the main tank. All but one appear to be stillborn (probably about 20 of them so far).
The problem now appears that she has this big bump at her vent. I'm thinking that since most of the fry are stillborn, one may have gotten stuck since they obviously can't swim out like the live fry. I don't know if this makes sense to anyone. But previous deliveries (with healthy live fry) only lasted a few hours while this one has gone on all day and the bump is still there despite no deliveries for many hours. With live fry I seem recall only a few minutes between deliveries. Is there anything I can do (other than trying a fish "C section")?
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Post by Carl on Jun 2, 2009 10:30:50 GMT -5
My opinion would be to try and gentley stroke the female Platy (a plastic pen cap or similar could provide the needed pressure without much harm to the adult Platy).
As well a bath in water with two teaspoons salt per gallon may help move the fluids through her body (a strong 3-5 minute dip in straight SW may help as well).
Carl
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Post by goldenpuon on Jun 2, 2009 15:54:10 GMT -5
I second what Carl said. But the fish with the bump, what does it look like? Also, is she acting like it is causing her any stress? I'm trying to see if this is disease related or not.
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Post by fishfever on Jun 2, 2009 16:58:59 GMT -5
Ok I will try the soft stroking and salt bath tonight. To me it looks like a sock hanging down directly in front of her anal fin but it's pretty large, I suspect part of it is the platy and part is another stillborn fry. I may try to take a picture of it once I get her in a hospital tank for the salt bath later this evening; it's hard to see it clearly now through the breeder cage netting. As far as stress, I'm really not sure. She's not moving around much in the cage. I tried dropping a few flakes of food in the net but she didn't eat it. But I also don't see the stillborn fry any more so she may have eaten those (unless they just decomposed that quickly).
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Post by fishfever on Jun 2, 2009 22:38:53 GMT -5
Here are two shots of her through the salt bath tank within the main tank. The bath tank has some water spots/bubbles making it not as clear and you are seeing through both the main tank glass and bath tank plastic. The reddish looking protrusion with the whitish bottom just in front of her anal fin is the bump. I believe the whitish part is the decaying stillborn fry but that's just a guess.   |
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Post by Carl on Jun 3, 2009 9:19:34 GMT -5
The area appears to be irritated/infected.
I would consider a direct swab of Methylene Blue, followed by some Neosporin on the infected area.
In tank treatment may be necessary (such as Triple Sulfa or Furan II), but see if you can help the fish via the baths, MB applications, etc. first
Carl
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Post by murdock6701 on Jun 3, 2009 19:15:34 GMT -5
hoe old is your fish? how many batches of fry has she produced? I raise platys, a lot of platys - have had this happen on a few occasions and only once was it non-fatal I am sorry to say - I don't believe it is a stock unhatched baby - more like a hernia - in one instance, mine lost he innards.....wish you luck and let us know if she's OK please!
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Post by fishfever on Jun 4, 2009 22:54:48 GMT -5
Well I have good news so far. I have been doing twice a day salt baths (mostly uniodized table salt and a small pinch of Epsom). Before putting her in the salt bath I have been using a Q-tip to swab her with MB. Then I dunked the Q-tip in the salt bath and swirled it to add some MB (mild) to the salt bath as well. After this bath (usually 45 minutes) I have been moving her back to the breeding cage to keep her isolated, but this time swabbing the area with Neosporin (with a new Q-tip). I leave her in the cage until time for the next bath. With each MB/Neosporin swab, I use the Q-tip to massage the area in the downward direction to try to pull the stillborn mass out. I think I need to read the article about how to do MB without stains since I have them all over my hands, face, pants and shirt (mostly from the platy wagging her tail while I'm trying to apply the MB with the Q-tip)!
Yesterday the swelling/redness went way down. Today it is gone. With the last salt bath a few minutes ago while I was massaging the area with the MB soaked Q-tip, the white mass (which I think is the stillborn fry) came loose. So now she looks normal with no bump. I still put a dab of Neosporin on the area before returning her to the breeding cage. So now I need to watch for infection I suppose? I'm going to order some meds from Carl's store to handle infection. I may not need it right now but it will be good to have on hand just in case. Plus I'm running short on other supplies anyway.
Murdock we have had this fish for less than half a year (no idea how old she was but since she was about half her current size she was probably a juvenile). This is her fourth pregnancy AFAIK, same as the other female adult platy (the one that recovered from constipation a while back). The white mass did not look like guts to me but I have never seen platy guts to be honest with you. Plus she is acting fairly normal right now so if it were her guts I thinking she would be acting very stressed or worse!
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Post by eve on Jun 5, 2009 15:08:12 GMT -5
that is really great news i hope she will survive this  |
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Post by fishfever on Jun 6, 2009 8:48:00 GMT -5
Sadly, she didn't make it through the night. Yesterday more "stuff" came out of her that looked different from the first white mass. This may have been the guts Murdock spoke of. Four pregnancies were one too many unfortunately. We still have a number of her living fry (the ones that haven't grown up and been given away yet) and we'll keep at least one.
The other adult female looks like she is carrying again so this will be her fifth! I wish there was a way to stop this but even with the males gone nature is finding a way (Jurassic Park quote).
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Post by murdock6701 on Jun 6, 2009 9:18:59 GMT -5
sorry to hear you lost your platy - I have found that once anything from the inside pops out, other than fry, it usually is fatal w/ platys - they are such cute and friendly little creatures, but unfortunately short lived
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Post by goldenpuon on Jun 6, 2009 9:49:42 GMT -5
Sorry to hear you lost your fish Fishfever. You did a very good job treating her but sometimes things like these happen. I breed guppies (a close relative of platies) and have never had this happen so far. Hopefully for you it will be your last. You did the best you could. Best of luck with your other female platy.
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Post by eve on Jun 6, 2009 10:29:00 GMT -5
i'm very sorry that she didn't make it  as john said, they're cute and beautiful, but they also have very short lives, and those pregnancy's are very stressful for them |
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Post by fishfever on Jun 7, 2009 11:22:58 GMT -5
Thanks everyone. We'll miss her and will remember her for being very peaceful; platys are generally this way anyway but I can't ever recall even the tiniest bit of aggression from her toward any other fish. Fortunately her babies seem to be the same way and we'll keep at least one of them in our tank.
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Post by murdock6701 on Jun 7, 2009 12:00:36 GMT -5
too bad you didn't live closer (like down the road) so I could give you some - I raise platys - I enjoy their peaceful attitude and beautiful colors - they are a compliment to any tank - I even keep them in w/ my yellow labs - nobody bothers them - I have over 200 fry at various stages presently - this has been through several parents at various stages - I try not to let them mate every 28 days - they live longer w/ less problems that way - have had platys live over 4 years - just have to have lots of small tanks!
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Post by fishfever on Jun 7, 2009 20:18:12 GMT -5
Haha, I really have enough platys. We have 6 juveniles (all female) in the main tank with the other adult female, and countless fry growing up in a small 10g. When they get older we move them to the main tank to get to a nice give-away size. We have been giving the males to Petland and the females to Petco to hopefully avoid any inbreeding by people adopting them (the stores are quite far away from each other). Now that we know about their prolific breeding habits, we won't allow any livebearer males/females to co-habitate? once they reach sexual maturity.
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Post by murdock6701 on Jun 7, 2009 21:34:35 GMT -5
you're lucky to have major brand named stores take your fish - I have to drive an hour each way to sell mine, but the mom and pop store id so freindly and they love what they buy from me and all works out well even if my profit margin is a bit thin w/ gas prices the way they are - it's way out in the country and a beautiful drive as well - I give a lot away as well to families w/ little kids because they're not high maintenance and non-aggressive and move around a lot - they bring me and others a lot of joy and enjoying your hobby is what it's all about - I currently have 6 different kinds, actually 7 - I have a cross I did myself between blue high fins and a yellow twin bar female - all the fry bear the mother's color, a bit more orange than yellow but all the males have the high red fin - they are prolific little buggers and overbreeding causes stress and premature death IMO
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Post by fishfever on Jun 8, 2009 20:09:37 GMT -5
I never realized how many (pure) platy colors there are until I wandered onto a web site (I forget which one). Nothing against the crosses but I wouldn't mind having a few more pure breeds with different coloring than the two colors we have already. Maybe I'll try to work out a trade the next time I bring some extra fish to the stores. The other problem (other than too much breeding) we have is that the platys tend to out-eat all the other fish in a mixed community tank. They eat at the surface, while the food is falling and even compete with the bottom feeders. Sometimes I have to overfeed the platies a bit in order to make sure the other species have enough to eat; although lately I've come up with some feeding schemes to even the playing field just a bit!
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Post by murdock6701 on Jun 8, 2009 20:18:43 GMT -5
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Post by fishfever on Jun 9, 2009 7:01:47 GMT -5
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