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Post by kagome on Apr 23, 2009 22:44:59 GMT -5
Tank Size: 10 gallon Age of the tank: just under two years pH: 7.2 Ammonia: 0 NitrAtes: 20 nitrites: 0 GH/KH:  Temperature: 76F Fish: 1- blue spotted gourami
1- 3" clown pleco
2- chinese butterfly loaches
3- angelicus loaches Symptoms: Sorry that I don't have the GH numbers but I don't have a way to test GH right now. I've been meaning to order a GH test, but money has been tight.
The gourami's body is swollen behind his gills bad enough that his scales are sticking out. He looks just like the photos that are in Carl's article on dropsy.
It's really weird that any fish in this tank should come down with dropsy. I do a 25% water change on this tank once a week without fail and I always thoroughly vacuum the gravel and stir up the entire floor of the tank. I am very careful to not overfeed and I feed only high quality food. And there is so much flow and aeration in that tank it is just ridiculous. The HOB could easily accommodate a tank 4 times that size. There is also an additional powerhead that has an 80 gph rate and an airstone bubbler running. I also add wondershells to the tank, as soon as one dissolves I add a new one.
I'm wondering if he might just simply have kidney or liver failure because he is so terribly old. I've had him for almost five years now.
I will do a 25% water change tomorrow and add a dose of metrodizonal (probably spelled that wrong) to see is that will help. I can't add salt to the tank because of the butterfly loaches, they are extremely sensitive to salt.
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Post by Carl on Apr 24, 2009 8:35:51 GMT -5
Sorry to read this kagome  I would consider baths and maybe even a saltwater dip (which is harsh, but is excellent in moving fluids out of the body since it literally dehydrates the fish). Please see this article in the Bath/Dip section: Aquarium Disease Prevention; Baths & DipsIn a bath the Metronidazole can be used at double dose along with MB and salt. Another medication (best fed) for Dropsy is NeomycinWater changes always help, in part by often improving Redox, so maybe try increasing the frequency to twice per week. Try feeding foods such as Frozen Brine Shrimp, not that this helps for Dropsy, but it can help with intestinal issues such as "gas". Mineral cations are also important for preventing and treating Dropsy (which unfortunately is often hard to treat, especially if age as you noted is a factor). Carl |
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Post by kagome on Apr 24, 2009 18:36:22 GMT -5
I did the water change and added both Metro and Kanamycin. I'm really hoping that I can help make him better.
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Post by kagome on Apr 25, 2009 0:33:50 GMT -5
Is the dropsy going to kill him if I the treatment doesn't make the swelling go down?  |
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Post by Carl on Apr 25, 2009 9:35:32 GMT -5
Unfortunatley the answer is yes kagome, although I gave successfully cured cases of mild to moderate dropsy, however this is the minority of cases. As well since Dropsy describes a symptom as much as a specific internal infection, the cause of the dropsy would make a difference in cure. For example a case of Dropsy where the main cause was an internal infection of Aeromonas Bacterium, this would be more treatable than a case where acute liver failure was the culprit. I think you have read my article about Dropsy, although a more basic article, the "cocktail approach" treatment does work in many cases. Aquarium Answers; DropsyGood Luck Carl |
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Post by goldenpuon on Apr 25, 2009 20:03:50 GMT -5
I have had two bettas die of dropsy, both pretty old males. I noticed something was wrong one day, that they had dropsy the next, and the day after that they both died even with treatemnt. Both got dropsy at different times and I don't believe I owned them at the same times as well.
For treatment, I would recommend Neomycin and salt baths like Carl suggested.
I wish you the best of luck treating this Kagome. Dropsy is hard to treat in my experience but don't lose hope. Just because it is hard to treat doesn't mean there isn't a chance your fish could recover. Best of luck Kagome. I hope he gets better.
Renee
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Post by kagome on Apr 25, 2009 22:23:35 GMT -5
Thank you very much Renee. I gave him a salt and MB bath and continued the Metro and Kanamycin. I have to say honestly that he looks much worse this evening. I'm still going to treat him but I don't hold out much hope for him.
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Post by barbara on Apr 25, 2009 23:10:30 GMT -5
I'm really sorry to read of this. It's easy to get attached to our finned friends, and I hope you realize this fish has had a great life with you. It's easy to tell from your posts that you try really hard with your babies, and this fish was lucky to have you.
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Post by kagome on Apr 27, 2009 23:28:54 GMT -5
Thank you, Barbara. He has been my little buddy for many years now. When we had to move in a hurry and give up our tanks he was the number one fish that I said I wanted to take with me.
I gave him another MB bath today, I slowly rose the salt level as he was in there. I also treated with the Kanamycin and Metro. Honestly though, he just looks worse and worse. All of the other fish in the tank look ok for now, I am watching this tank very closely.
The one thing I wonder is that if my water parameters were at all bad then the butterfly loaches would have died almost immediately because they are so sensitive. I really don't think that I neglected the tank and let conditions deteriorate causing him to get sick.
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Post by Carl on Apr 28, 2009 9:13:52 GMT -5
Sorry he is going down hill kagome. unfortunately in advanced cases especially in older fish, treatment is usually not effective.
However my view is to continue trying until you feel he is suffering too much (just an opinion though)
You might consider the dip I mentioned earlier, but his may not help either.
This is a good point, I really do not think (nor did I) that this is/was the problem. Age is the likely cause IMO.
Carl
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Post by kagome on Apr 30, 2009 0:15:58 GMT -5
I checked all the parameters and everything is still at the same levels. I gave him another medicated bath, he is still hanging in there, but he's also now starting to act weird, hanging out in places in the tank where he usually doesn't and he doesn't seem to want to eat much. I don't know if I should euthanize him or not since he seems to keep getting a little worse and worse. I just really don't think I can do it, my husband is also very attached to this fish so asking him to do it is also tough. This just sucks.
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Post by Carl on Apr 30, 2009 9:49:23 GMT -5
I checked all the parameters and everything is still at the same levels. I gave him another medicated bath, he is still hanging in there, but he's also now starting to act weird, hanging out in places in the tank where he usually doesn't and he doesn't seem to want to eat much. I don't know if I should euthanize him or not since he seems to keep getting a little worse and worse. I just really don't think I can do it, my husband is also very attached to this fish so asking him to do it is also tough. This just sucks. I know this is always a hard decision, even when clients would agree that this was the best answer (to euthanize), and although the fish in question was not mine, I still knew many of my clients and their fish on a personal basis, so it was not pleasant and since this is your pet, I really feel bad and understand. I wish I could give you more useful suggestions for helping, but I cannot. Carl |
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Post by murdock6701 on Apr 30, 2009 13:25:22 GMT -5
sorry K.....
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Post by goldenpuon on Apr 30, 2009 16:52:47 GMT -5
Sorry to hear that Kagome. I hope he beats the odds and makes a comeback. Best of luck.
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Post by bikeguy33 on Apr 30, 2009 16:59:18 GMT -5
sorry to hear this. when it comes time.....i can help out with humanely doing it...
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