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Post by coco on Mar 3, 2020 9:49:16 GMT -5
I have been treating this poor little guy in a hospital tank for about 2 months now. He developed very pale patches on the side of his body around Christmas. It was very slow moving. Fins were still fine, appetite good, still playing like a typical cory. Because it seemed so mild I tried Maracyn 2 first. Was responding at first, but didn't completely get rid of it. That was for 10 days. I tried the sulfaplex next, as I had that on hand. Used that for the maximum treatment that was allowed. Didn't work. Now it's starting to cover more of his body. Fins are still fine though, same with barbells, no redness around the patches, still eating and playing. I ordered the Spectogram, and used that next for the maximum dose. Didn't work. I tried the Triple Sulfa next, thinking maybe that would be stronger than Sulfaplex from Seachem. Didn't work. I admit, I wasn't doing the baths during this, because as the baths work so well for so many other fish, I find it really tends to stress corys. I have been doing the baths now for aprx. 3 weeks. This little guy is tolerating them better than most. I drip the Wound Control on first, then place him in with the MB and salt.The columnaris is less than it was, but still there. Fins are still perfect, no redness or open wounds, still eating, barbells still there (although I just noticed this morning a little pale patch above the mouth area). I just have a medicated shell in there now. This has been going on for over two months now. I know it doesn't seem typical of Columnaris. It's like a super slow moving mild version that's super resistant at the same time. So strange. I am so technology challenged, if I new how to attach pics from my phone to my laptop I would add a pic. I can't imagine what else it could possible be, other than Columnaris. Classic stringy/moldy look. Not the fluffy mold of Saprogenia. The little guy is still so active, I hate to give up on him, but I don't know what else to do. Maybe baths in the PP? I have never used that for fish baths before. I just use it to bath new plants before I place them in my tank. My bath holder is 1/4 gallon. If you think the PP bath is a good idea, how many drops for a 1/4 gallon container? Anything else I could use as a swab, other than the Wound Control? Take to consider, the Columnaris is on his head, right next to his eyes and gills. It has to be something that wouldn't burn them while swabbing. It's impossible to not get any in while you are swabbing that close.
Sorry for the long post, I'm out of ideas.
-Nicole.
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Post by devonjohnsgard on Mar 3, 2020 12:36:38 GMT -5
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Post by Carl on Mar 3, 2020 13:10:43 GMT -5
What are your water parameters? What is the filtration & diet as well as conditioners/products used? Maracyn is definitely not an effective treatment for Columnaris is truly the problem. Even as Erythromycin products goes, it is an inferior product being Erythromycin Sulfate versus the better Erythromycin Phosphate (as found in AAP Myacin) Reference: www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Columnaris.htmlWhat are you using in the baths? The best in tank treatment would be AAP Spectrogram or Fuaracyn www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Aquatronics.htmlCan you provide a close up picture? Regards; Carl |
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Post by coco on Mar 3, 2020 16:54:01 GMT -5
He developed this right after I got him, in the quarantine tank. I now have him in a 2 1/2 gallon hospital tank. I initially put a hydro sponge from another tank in with him for bio media/o2. Ammonia had been zero through most of the treatment, but due to all the different meds I have tried it destroyed the bacteria. I grabbed more media from another tank, and that after sometime got destroyed too. I have been maintaining the ammonia in the hospital tank to under .50, usually closer to .25 by regular water changes and prime. Ph has been yo-yoing a bit due to constant water changes. Between 6.8-7.2. I know that stresses him, but I have been running out of extra media to use. I am gonna grab another hydor sponge from my assassin snail tank, that should be just about fully seeded. The only filtration is the hydro bubble sponge. Mini heater keeping it at 75. I have been keeping a small wondershell in with him. Right now there is a medicated wondershell in there. In tank salt of 1 tablespoon per 5 gallons. Diet is Spurulina 20, Hikari mini wafers, Hikari Vibra bites. Conditioners have been the ResQ and Sheildex. Along with the Prime for Amonia/Nitrite control. The baths are swabbing with Wound Control, MB, and salt. I already used the full treatment of in tank Spectrogram, but was not bathing at the same time. It has been a few weeks since I tried the Spectrogram, is it too soon to use it again to do it with the same time as the baths? ....As far as the pic goes, if I can find someone to show me how to attach pics from my phone to my laptop, I could send one.
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Post by Carl on Mar 5, 2020 13:42:23 GMT -5
Sorry for the slow reply (I have to multi task a lot of late) If you could maybe share a link to a picture, that might be useful or post in our Facebook version of EA www.facebook.com/groups/471149673786076/Baths might be helpful, but I understand the stress upon Corys For a swab, I have found Wound Control the most effective and broad spectrum. This said, you could also swab with MB As for a PP bath, I have never figured it down to drops (usually by fractions of a teaspoon), but you could add it until the water is moderately red As for in tank treatment, has ANY treatment shown any sign of helping a little? This may hold a clue as to what to try next (maybe PolyGuard, Doxycycline or double dose of Spectrogram) Resources: www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Seachem.html#polyguardwww.americanaquariumproducts.com/AquariumPharmaceuticalsAPI.html#fin-body |
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Post by Carl on Mar 5, 2020 14:07:53 GMT -5
You can also email me a picture here, and I will attach it to the thread after hosting:
carl@everything-aquatic.com
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Post by coco on Mar 6, 2020 13:32:00 GMT -5
Ok, I will work on the pic tonight when he gets his second bath. After I swab with the Wound Control, I hold him in the net above the water in his bath and drip the MB right on him, so he gets it at full strength. As far as which meds have had effect, its hard to say. Unless I shine the light on him, you cant really see the fuzzy patches. There were times I thought it was almost gone, until I shined a bright light on him. He just started to develop the pale spot above his mouth a couple days ago. He has been in this hospital tank about two months now, and his fins are still complete without any rot. I re-started the spectrogram this morning because of the beginning stages of mouth rot. You said to try double strength in tank treatment of Spectrogram. That won't be harmful to his kidneys? I can try adding some to the bath too, if I am using the MB, but that will be difficult to judge as I use a 1/4 gallon container. I will order the Polygaurd to have on hand in case this doesn't work. Maybe try the PP for the baths. Do you put the salt in the PP baths too? or just the PP alone? Again, I will work on the pic thing tonight. Thanx for the help  |
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Post by coco on Mar 6, 2020 21:19:46 GMT -5
Ok, hopefully I sent a pic to your email Carl. Never use my phone for email, just my laptop. I'm so technology challenged.  |
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Post by Carl on Mar 7, 2020 13:09:36 GMT -5
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Post by coco on Mar 7, 2020 16:52:49 GMT -5
Ok, thanks Carl. You know, I had questioned both of those. I was reading your articles on the Streptococus, and looking at the pictures. Same with the Costia. But, I kept going back to the Columnaris. I also thought if it was Costia, my other fish that live in the quarantine tank should have contracted it. So maybe go with treating the Strep first. The fuzzy film used to be all over his body, but you can see it's mostly just on the head area now. Maybe the Wound Control and MB baths helped somewhat with that? I just ordered the Myacin, Polygaurd, & more Wound Control. I'm determined to fix this little guy. |
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Post by devonjohnsgard on Mar 7, 2020 21:30:45 GMT -5
I havent seen this too much. Glad you got the picture. That was very helpful to see.
Glad Carl was able to give you advise.
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Post by coco on Mar 12, 2020 8:31:57 GMT -5
I should be receiving my medications today. I am undecided which med to try first. I put newly seeded media in with him last week, so the ammonia/nitrite has been zero. This week I treated (for the second time), with the Spectrogram. Except this time he was getting the baths at the same time. Still, no effect. He was developing a pale patch above his mouth, which is usually beginning stages of mouth rot/columnaris, so I wanted to give the Spectrogram a second shot, with added baths this time. I also put the Spectrogram in the baths, but no effect. So, if we are unsure if it is strep or costia, can the Polygaurd treat both? If I try the Myacin first, and it is actually a parasitic condition, I am afraid it will destroy the biomedia I just added. I have gone through all my extra media, don't have any more after this. Can the Polygaurd treat Strep?
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Post by Carl on Mar 12, 2020 14:07:08 GMT -5
You make a good point here.
For this reason I would treat for Strep first.
Correct me if I am wrong, but this has been going on for some time? If so, usually with Columnaris, the fish would have died.
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Post by coco on Mar 12, 2020 15:14:12 GMT -5
Yes, this has been going on for over two months. Can the Polygaurd treat Strep? Or do I just go with the Myacin? The Myacin will probably blow out the bio media I just put in there, but if that's the only thing that will work, that's what I will use.
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Post by Carl on Mar 13, 2020 16:41:37 GMT -5
Yes, this has been going on for over two months. Can the Polygaurd treat Strep? Or do I just go with the Myacin? The Myacin will probably blow out the bio media I just put in there, but if that's the only thing that will work, that's what I will use. PolyGuard likely will not help if this is Strep. Yes, Myacin is hard on the bio filter too. You can also combine Maycin with Super Velvet Plus (if you have the later) for an extra "punch" |
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Post by coco on Mar 13, 2020 21:49:40 GMT -5
Do not have the Velvet Plus. I started the Myacin this morning. Says it depletes O2, so I added an extra stone hooked up to a separate air pump. Got the bubbles really cranking in there. He was playing in them earlier. It's strange, there have been times I see him very lethargic and in weird positions where I thought he was dead. Other times he's very playful like a typical cory. Maybe there's still hope for him. |
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Post by Carl on Mar 14, 2020 10:22:21 GMT -5
Do not have the Velvet Plus. No problem, as this may not even help. GREAT! Hopefully! |
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Post by coco on Mar 14, 2020 15:17:01 GMT -5
The thing that still bugs me is this newly developed mouth rot that started about 2 weeks ago. Even that would not respond to the Spectrogram. Can the Strep cause mouth rot also? Or is it just caused by Columnaris?
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Post by Carl on Mar 15, 2020 11:34:29 GMT -5
The thing that still bugs me is this newly developed mouth rot that started about 2 weeks ago. Even that would not respond to the Spectrogram. Can the Strep cause mouth rot also? Or is it just caused by Columnaris? I have not seen what I know to be fish strep. to cause mouth fungus (not that it cannot happen, only that I have not observed this) Spectrogram is very effective for Columnaris, especially at double dose assuming all other important aspects of Columnaris are being followed Reference: www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Columnaris.html#treatment1This said, it is quite possible for a Columnaris infection to develop resistance to the ingredients in Spectrogram, especially if weaker doses are used and even more specifically if the Kanaplex/Furan 2 combo is used (which is much less effective due to fact it cannot bee used 100% at the same time). If you can send me a picture of this new mouth infection, I would like to see it |
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Post by coco on Mar 15, 2020 15:29:04 GMT -5
Followed all those Columnaris suggestions, except the "double" dose of Spectrogram. Even put it in the bath, too. Ok, I wil get the pic when I give him his night time bath. He is hiding under his little bridge right now. Don't want to bother him more than I have to.  I will have to send it to your email again if that's ok. One of these days I will have someone show me how to put my phone pics on my laptop. |
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I will have to send it to your email again if that's ok. One of these days I will have someone show me how to put my phone pics on my laptop.