Hi from beautiful Upstate New York

[chuckm6421]

Hi Carl, Devon, all

I've recently returned to this hobby with a new interest in aquaria at a more sophisticated level than maintaining a goldfish bowl. For several years I kept a 20 gallon freshwater planted tank that we came into from my daughter's classmate. Thought it'd be a fun project for the two of us but it never clicked with her, so I kept it up anyway having had one many moons ago but without the benefit of the mighty internets to find lots of information quickly. Jump ahead to 6 months ago when I found myself serendipitously laid off from work and able to retire, and I decided to do an aquarium "right". Found a Craigslist 65 gallon (needing the bottom glass reattached) and basic stand and off I went (after completely removing and regluing and resealing the bottom).

Noteworthy, I suppose, about this setup is that I came across the postings of a certain eccentric Youtuber with a PhD who zealously advocated for anoxic filtration using a plenum and deep gravel bed. I researched the idea separate from his own work and found enough supporting work to decide to give it a go and I don't have any regrets now, 5 months on. This means my tank has a layer of Bioballs first with a plastic mesh (used by needlepointers) cover forming an intentional dead space, then 3 inches of a 70/30 mix of washed Oil-Dri baked clay and Carib Sea Eco Complete. Also, as part of the Craigslist deal, I relieved the seller of a Fluval Edge 6 gallon (free!) and rehabbed and stocked that as well. It also is using a plenum made from undergravel filter grids and an inch of the same substrate. That one's been...a challenge.

So what brings me here. Both tanks have shown good water quality test results, the dreaded nitrates hovering between 20 and 40, ammonia nearly undetectable, pH in the high 7's. But they're both in very bright rooms with the 65 gallon actually getting some direct sunlight late in the day around sundown. It has a Finnex 24/7 CC planted+ lamp which I think I've dialed in to the right balance of good quality light and no algae growth.

I think.

~~~~

While there's no visible algae anywhere in the tank, the water, while very clear, still has a very slight green tint. In fact I picked up a Marineland Magnum diatom filter to see if diatomaceous earth (a filtration product I'm very familiar with) would clear it but it doesn't. So after consulting today with a trusted local fish store I set my sights on possibly UV sterilization which lead me to this most excellent website and forum (donation sent!).

I'm hoping to come up with a solution that does not include a submerged pump since I've tried to keep the tank as clean of technology and natural looking as I can. It's in the living room and the last place for something looking like a lab experiment!. I've been using an Aquaclear 110 HOB with a couple sponge filters tucked in the corners (mostly for emergency use, they're on a battery powered air pump).

[Carl]

Hi and Welcome to Everything Aquatic!!

I am curious as to your Plenum filter, as so many designs did not not perform well, but yours seems to be doing an excellent job.
If you could share a picture of your design.

Here is a picture of one similar to the many I used a few decades back that did NOT do well over time.


As to the UV, if you want the best results as well as longevity, I would suggest the Vecton UVs run with a separate pump/filter and returned to your aquarium over any submersible UV (including those AAP sells)

Resource:
www.americanaquariumproducts.com/TMCUVSterilizer.html

Carl

[devonjohnsgard]

Hi! Welcome!

When was this tank set up? You may be seeing some new tank symptoms.

I'm familiar with the Plenum filter your talking about. It out of the blue became very popular about a year ago, so I did some heavy research into it.

I actually don't agree with the points the doc contributed the success of his tank too using this filter method. He claims it's the filter keeping Nitrates lows (when it's mature). I'm 99% positive it's more of the constant release of reducing minerals in the tank from the clay material. This constant release of minerals in the tank is also what Carl promotes, just using a different method. It aids in keeping the Redox balance. Same with using a UV.

So, a UV will help with algae, both your plenum and UV would aid in the healthiest Redox for your tank.

Here's a basic article to go over Redox... Then there's a more in depth one on the AAP site.

www.fishbeginner.info/home/what-makes-a-healthy-aquarium-or-unhealthy/

[devonjohnsgard]

Just so my point is clear. It's not the filter lowering the Nitrates that I think he's getting his success from. It's more the filter releasing constant redox reducing minerals that I think is really giving the success.

[chuckm6421]

Thanks guys.
I want to better respond but have a lot going on right now. Give me a day and I'll get a Dropbox account and post some pictures.
Certainly the doctor got me thinking about AF and has a video showing basically how to build one, but one other person who spelled it out and made clear what was going on was Youtuber Jay's aquarium and his great series of videos clarifying (sorry) how AF fits in the nitrogen cycle. My take-away from all this is the system requires a low flowrate. I was in contact with someone from GARF about their plenum ideas and a high flowrate but couldn't get a clear answer why they felt it was necessary. In fact both my filters (in the 65 gallon and the 6 gallon Edge) are turned down as much as reasonable.

I did get to skim the Redox info and will definitely dig deeper tonight.

(I'm pretty sure the small Vecton is in my future, but I need to replace my aging leaf-blower first)

[kagome]

OK this is crazy. I have to admit that I had not heard of this kind of filter before. It seems like the whole idea is that the baskets become populated with denitrifying anaerobic bacteria that process nitrate into nitrogen gas.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbSv54F3xnE

I've seen a bunch of videos of people saying that once they got these up and running, takes 45-60 days. That the nitrates go down to 0. I tend to believe their results since they have absolutely gorgeous discus swimming around so you know they're serious aquarists who must be doing something right.

I really wish I had a sump so I could try this out.

You know, if your main concern is the appearance of the pump inside the tank, you might be able to use a filter or heater cover. That way you wouldn't see the pump or the lines.

www.junglebobsreptileworld.com/collections/supplies-aquarium-supplies-aquarium-heater-covers/products/heater-cover-fresh-water

www.aqua-maniac.com/eng_m_Filter-Covers-150.html

Just a thought.

[devonjohnsgard]

Oct 30, 2018 12:21:58 GMT -5 kagome said:

OK this is crazy. I have to admit that I had not heard of this kind of filter before. It seems like the whole idea is that the baskets become populated with denitrifying anaerobic bacteria that process nitrate into nitrogen gas.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=vbSv54F3xnE

I've seen a bunch of videos of people saying that once they got these up and running, takes 45-60 days. That the nitrates go down to 0. I tend to believe their results since they have absolutely gorgeous discus swimming around so you know they're serious aquarists who must be doing something right.

I really wish I had a sump so I could try this out.

You know, if your main concern is the appearance of the pump inside the tank, you might be able to use a filter or heater cover. That way you wouldn't see the pump or the lines.

www.junglebobsreptileworld.com/collections/supplies-aquarium-supplies-aquarium-heater-covers/products/heater-cover-fresh-water

www.aqua-maniac.com/eng_m_Filter-Covers-150.html

Just a thought.

I got really excited about it when I saw it as well, but once really talking it over with Carl, I realized that just dosing a wonder shell is more important. Or looking at the filter as a constant mineral release like the wonder shell is more important. If we have these minerals, Nitrate control isn't as important. There's many ways to have zero nitrate, but people could still have health issues. It takes a lot of Nitrate to cause an issue. But having the minerals with or without Nitrate, you'd find the success with fish like Discus.