Sanders Reef Tank

[devonjohnsgard]

Awesome to see the progress on the tank. Awesome shop for metal working!

I will contact Orphek now. I'll see if there's a dim option or if they can preset it to get us about 300 PAR at the ground level, mounting it 4-5 above the tank.

[devonjohnsgard]

Info back from Orphek, they're able to get about 300 PAR at the base of the tank. So, they will dim it for us. I requested a 18K spectrum. They're going to put a 14K on one channel and blue on another channel. It will be a 18-20K spectrum.

All we need to do is get an invoice to put together, then we can have Orphek ship the light.

Let me know if you want to move forward with this light.

Thanks!

[leon]

Lets move forward on the light - if it is 4'-5' above the tank do we need to dim it or is this a case of more is not necessarily better? From that height does the coral sleeve in the middle even become an issue? Just asking - you guys obviously know lighting.

In regards to float I was thinking of a toilet bowl float as well but hesitated bringing it up as I thought ya'll would get a good laugh - but apparently we were on the same page.

The sump will be going in this week. First chamber - lava rock you suggested a sponge type filter overhanging the sides - I could go this route or put a sponge/filter pad on top of the rock. Dims of the first chamber are about 16" x 18". Also what do you suggest for the material I use on the wiper ring that will scrub the inside of the tank?

[Carl]

Dec 19, 2016 18:41:43 GMT -5 leon said:

In regards to float I was thinking of a toilet bowl float as well but hesitated bringing it up as I thought ya'll would get a good laugh - but apparently we were on the same page.

I am happy to read we are the same page, especially since you have such a creative mechanical mind!

The sump will be going in this week. First chamber - lava rock you suggested a sponge type filter overhanging the sides - I could go this route or put a sponge/filter pad on top of the rock. Dims of the first chamber are about 16" x 18". Also what do you suggest for the material I use on the wiper ring that will scrub the inside of the tank?

I suggest a high flow reticulated sponge material attached to the pump pick up (such as the Hydro Pond material) and maybe on the water entry point over the lava rock (using a pvc spray bar)

Fine Poly filter media can also be rolled into a slot where water moves from one chamber to the next to further polish the water.
This same poly fiber can be wrapped around the ring as a scrubber

Resource (it can be purchased in lengths too by the foot by changing from 1 to 2, 3, etc.):
www.americanaquariumproducts.com/AquariumPondFilterMaterial.html#polypads

www.americanaquariumproducts.com/HydroPondFilter.html

Carl

[devonjohnsgard]

Dec 19, 2016 18:41:43 GMT -5 leon said:

Lets move forward on the light - if it is 4'-5' above the tank do we need to dim it or is this a case of more is not necessarily better? From that height does the coral sleeve in the middle even become an issue? Just asking - you guys obviously know lighting.

The hope is with the light mounted that high, it wont be an issue.

The light is meant to be used in 15 meters of water, being able to grow all corals. We're lighting like 4 meters, so our goal is to not have too intense lighting. Towards the top is going to be much higher PAR. I'm asking for about 300 PAR at the bottom of the tank, so you could grow what every you wanted towards the bottom. This means the top could be more like 1000 PAR. Corals can grow at this, but do have to be acclimated so they don't bleach. The hardest corals can be grown about 300 PAR, so anything above 300 is extra. Great for SPS.

I'll get the invoice together.

[devonjohnsgard]

Invoice sent

[devonjohnsgard]

Got your paid invoice! Orphek is notified to start the process. So you know, you will be the first person in the world to have this LED on a private aquarium... Right now they are just one commercial grade

When you said you like to pick up the extreme end of high end hobbys... well you just reached a new level.

[devonjohnsgard]

Orphek is ready to make the light. They're wanting to know how long the power cable needs to be?

[leon]

Hmmm guess I should feel special about being their first! 10' should be sufficient for the cord. Where is the light coming from-just trying to get an ETA not that I am ready for it yet.

I have the outdoor sump house built and will be installing the sump/pump/skimmer/sand filter etc. over the course of the next few days. Currently I have it configured as per Carl's sketch with 4 chambers and now have a few questions/comments. I do not yet know exactly what livestock and coral will be in the main tank planned on letting that evolve once the entire system is up and running. I tried digging through all the info on your sight but thought it would be easier to just ask questions here. It is my understanding coral and some fish eat certain types algae that can be grown in a refugium type sump and growing the algae helps with the bio filtration. Also with the current configuration of the main tank I am going to loose the sand on the bottom and the benefits of the sand. The sump has two bulkhead fittings on the bottom (chamber 2 and 3)one in chamber 3 will be used to feed the main pump under tank which leaves the last (4th) chamber empty (was suggested to put pump in here) Could that chamber be filled with oolite sand and grow algae or other stuff? Would the algae be killed with UV?

I just don't want to get it all installed and find out there are some cool things I should have/could have done differently.

I can sketch up what I am thinking if you think it is worth discussing. (how do I embed a picture?)

[devonjohnsgard]

Dec 21, 2016 13:10:08 GMT -5 leon said:

Hmmm guess I should feel special about being their first! 10' should be sufficient for the cord. Where is the light coming from-just trying to get an ETA not that I am ready for it yet.

I have the outdoor sump house built and will be installing the sump/pump/skimmer/sand filter etc. over the course of the next few days. Currently I have it configured as per Carl's sketch with 4 chambers and now have a few questions/comments. I do not yet know exactly what livestock and coral will be in the main tank planned on letting that evolve once the entire system is up and running. I tried digging through all the info on your sight but thought it would be easier to just ask questions here. It is my understanding coral and some fish eat certain types algae that can be grown in a refugium type sump and growing the algae helps with the bio filtration. Also with the current configuration of the main tank I am going to loose the sand on the bottom and the benefits of the sand. The sump has two bulkhead fittings on the bottom (chamber 2 and 3)one in chamber 3 will be used to feed the main pump under tank which leaves the last (4th) chamber empty (was suggested to put pump in here) Could that chamber be filled with oolite sand and grow algae or other stuff? Would the algae be killed with UV?

I just don't want to get it all installed and find out there are some cool things I should have/could have done differently.

I can sketch up what I am thinking if you think it is worth discussing. (how do I embed a picture?)

I'll let Orphek know. I'm not sure where it's coming from. I'll get an ETA

I think growing algae in the sump is a great idea. I believe the configuration would work, but Carl should double check. I believe this would be called a refugium. Take a look at this article. There's even a good video and the how too.

www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Basic_Saltwater.html

[Carl]

This article (a sub article of the one Devon provided) provides a couple of Refugium examples, including a video:
www.americanaquariumproducts.com/Saltwatersetup.html

There is no one correct way to make a refugium or sump refugium combination.

Yours is a lot larger than most, which gives you more options too

Could you make a sketch of how your bulk heads aligned along with the partitions?

The email from Orphek stated production time is 12 days, plus shipping time (which I am unsure where it is coming from, but likely not USA due to the $170 shipping we are being charged)

Carl

[leon]

Still not sure how to put pictures right into the posts but here is another link to my artistically challenged sump. drive.google.com/open?id=0Bxc4Er6VZHIgeHhNU3Y4amFFREU

Far left chamber is where the water enters. 3rd chamber was protein skimmer and I was thinking of main pump pulling from the 3rd chamber bulkhead. Was thinking of putting a short 6" baffle sealed to the floor/walls about 1/2" or so from the last raised baffle and filling the 4th chamber with 4"-6" of sand and growing algae stuff in the 4th chamber.

If some of the growth is to feed the coral and fish would the UV kill it if the UV was on the main pump discharge back to the main tank?

[devonjohnsgard]

Dec 22, 2016 12:09:09 GMT -5 leon said:

Still not sure how to put pictures right into the posts but here is another link to my artistically challenged sump. drive.google.com/open?id=0Bxc4Er6VZHIgeHhNU3Y4amFFREU

Far left chamber is where the water enters. 3rd chamber was protein skimmer and I was thinking of main pump pulling from the 3rd chamber bulkhead. Was thinking of putting a short 6" baffle sealed to the floor/walls about 1/2" or so from the last raised baffle and filling the 4th chamber with 4"-6" of sand and growing algae stuff in the 4th chamber.

If some of the growth is to feed the coral and fish would the UV kill it if the UV was on the main pump discharge back to the main tank?

Looks good to me. I didn't answer that question when you asked it last.

The UV will not harm any growth of the algae. The UV only works on water that goes through the UV, so beneficial bacteria in filters and your plants your growing will be fine.

Trying to get how long shipping takes and where it's coming from. Waiting on Orphek.

[devonjohnsgard]

3-4 days shipping time DHL from Hong Kong.

[devonjohnsgard]

Order made.

[Carl]

Dec 22, 2016 12:09:09 GMT -5 leon said:

Still not sure how to put pictures right into the posts but here is another link to my artistically challenged sump. drive.google.com/open?id=0Bxc4Er6VZHIgeHhNU3Y4amFFREU

Far left chamber is where the water enters. 3rd chamber was protein skimmer and I was thinking of main pump pulling from the 3rd chamber bulkhead. Was thinking of putting a short 6" baffle sealed to the floor/walls about 1/2" or so from the last raised baffle and filling the 4th chamber with 4"-6" of sand and growing algae stuff in the 4th chamber.

If some of the growth is to feed the coral and fish would the UV kill it if the UV was on the main pump discharge back to the main tank?

Leon;
You can add pictures/drawings as an attachment (button on the upper right corner)

Thanks for the drawing.
I am unclear why the bulk heads on the bottom, could you explain how these will be working as normally with a sump, any bulkhead (if even needed) would be on the side? Are these maybe for cleaning?

Also, I was think after I asked for a drawing, that pictures of this or your progression would be not only helpful, but interesting and educational!

Carl

[leon]

Ah ha - not only artistically challenged but technologically challenged the whole thread I was just using "quick reply" when I hit reply it gave me all kinds of options. Good to know.

The bulkheads were in the tank when I purchased it used. There were two pumps underneath in a double tube arrangement, there was a pvc grate with screen door mesh on top and the aquarium rock on top of the mesh. Water would be pulled down through the outer tube (flush with bottom) to the pump and discharged through 1/2" pvc about 6" above the bottom. Will takes some pics and put them up tomorrow. It actually would work similarly to the sand filter if the riser were the suction and discharge to the outer tube which would be flush to the bottom and the chamber filled with 4"-8" of sand. I contemplated making one chamber into a dedicated sand filter as described for a cleaner installation but being my first rodeo thought I would follow your suggestions. But if you are interested in some R&D I am all in.

I would be happy to post pics of the progression (although my wife has the main tank wrapped with Christmas decorations at the moment because it is empty) - appreciate the help and outside the box thinking.

Leon

[devonjohnsgard]

[Carl]

Hi Leon;
Devon showed me the pictures.

What I cannot tell is how the dividers are arranged, as it is important that the water flow goes fully through each chamber. As I noted in an earlier post, that means staggered dividers (some high, some low).
As an example, the first chamber where the water enters with the volcanic rock would work properly if the divider allows water to pass via the bottom. If not possible, as small pump placed on the bottom to feed the water to the next chamber or even to the last chamber should help.

I noted the pump was not the last, so getting water to this chamber is important (such as using a small pump of about 300-400 gph) to move water from the bottom of the first chamber to the last one which appears to be your refugium/deep sand chamber

I am not sure you need to use the bulk head on the right, this can covered with a silicone sheet of glass, which could be cut back off if needed later.

With the bulk head on the left. the pump can be placed in the sump, with a screwed connection through the bottom. Just make sure the water flow keeps this chamber more full

Carl

[leon]

Quick progress update. We have the sump house up and running. The RIO 32 pumps from the first chamber to a manifold that feeds the protein skimmer, sand filter, and also discharges into the bottom of the 2nd and 3rd chambers going up tubes that have holes drilled into them creating a "shower" in these chambers. Chambers 2 and 3 will eventually be filled with live rock and a bed to grow algae. I am not sure if the "shower" in these chambers helps anything but the bulkheads were already there so I thought it may help aerate the water. We cut a hole in the bottom of the 4th chamber, added a larger bulkhead and direct mounted the Sun pump. Main flow pulls from the 4th chamber into the main tank and gravity feeds through the overflow and back to the 1st chamber. We did a trial run on Sunday and filled the entire system. With all the piping and head pressure it took almost 15 minutes to fill the main tank with the Sun pump so we are getting about 4/4-1/2 turns per hour. Unfortunately the discharge column in the main tank leaks at the bottom so we are going to remove it this weekend and reinforce the sealing area - ugh!



Once we get the leak fixed we will refill the system and let it run for a while while we work on the live rock column that will go over the discharge column. Also we will be working on the cleaning ring to wash the inside of the main tank.



As you can see we made a change on the main discharge - plugged the small holes and put (4) 3/4" discharge nozzles. Was afraid we may plug the small holes. The design is different than what was suggested we are no longer pulling from the bottom but I think I can incorporate the 3rd pump into the column and get the internal flow that Carl suggested we do. We are planning to fill the bottom 3-4" with sand - can we just use the local beach sand or is there a problem with doing that?