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Post by Carl on Sept 26, 2011 14:23:59 GMT -5
That link/article you provided was a great idea. I have used bell diffusers (such as the sanders) with good results, as well I have placed limewood or ceramic under an upside down Sponge Filter, but this idea seems to have the best of all methods. I had a friend a few years ago make a similar DIY CO2 diffuser using a Sponge Pre-Filter and he somehow attached a CO2 supply and a pump to this Pre-Filter, but I have never attempted to duplicate his idea (which he had very good results immediately too). He sent me a picture, and I need to find this so as to duplicate it too Anyway, congrats on getting this going well. Carl
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Post by parker002 on Sept 26, 2011 14:33:15 GMT -5
The most common implementation I've seen so far is using a standard powerhead (like a Penguin), a gravel siphon, and a sponge pre-filter. The pre-filter is attached to the powerhead intake with the gravel siphon attached to the output. Then you place it in the tank with the output facing down instead of the intake. Fairly simple but really bulky.
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Post by parker002 on Sept 26, 2011 14:40:14 GMT -5
Here's a pic. I need to put a better sponge material in the bottom. The filter floss lets out bigger bubbles and collects debris, so eventually the pressure causes it to pop out of the tube.
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Post by Carl on Sept 26, 2011 18:56:29 GMT -5
After you noted this DIY method, I dug up a very similar idea a friend in the hobby/business sent me (I have had this picture 4 years and forgot about it). He used a Rio 600, an airline control valve and a Filter Max #2. I put one together myself immediately after re-reading his email from 2007. This keeps the CO2 swirling down inside and with the built in cap on these pre-filters, does not have the issue of blowing out the sponge material. Here is a picture (I also added it to Freshwater Plant Care Information): Carl
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Post by parker002 on Sept 27, 2011 9:21:51 GMT -5
Interesting. I may have to try that - it seems to be the intermediate step between the power head version and my version (in terms of the space it takes in the tank)...
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Post by babygeige on Sept 27, 2011 17:18:50 GMT -5
This is all very interesting! I may try this sometime. I'm sure the CO2 I'm putting into my tank isn't dissolving much in the water, if at all.
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Post by goldenpuon on Sept 28, 2011 0:52:57 GMT -5
Carl and Parker, you two have exchanged some excellent ideas as far as CO2 diffuser designs. They are very creative and also (based on the results) also excellent for getting CO2 into the tank. Though I kjnow very little about how CO2 diffusers, if I ever start keeping plants, I will definitely look back at this thread for insight and ideas for CO2. Renee This is a great discussion IMO and useful for anyone that has plants.
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Post by parker002 on Sept 28, 2011 8:12:53 GMT -5
So far, my efforts have NOT yielded great results when it comes to actually getting CO2 into the tank.
The design flaw I think I'm dealing with right now is that the gravel siphon is the 1" diameter variety and that's too small. I can lessen pressure overall and improve the function (I think) if I use a larger-diameter tube.
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Post by Carl on Sept 28, 2011 9:28:37 GMT -5
I thought you were getting pearling shortly after installation. With the method I set up, the CO2 levels were double that of a standard bell diffuser (approx 8 ppm to 16 ppm, but these were later tests, I need to check earlier in the day). I only used Jungle Fizz tabs too I can still see the CO2 swirling inside the filter max hours after the Fizz tabs have dissolved too. Carl
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Post by parker002 on Sept 28, 2011 15:31:59 GMT -5
I'm using yeast and I think the issue is simply that my production has fallen off. I may have screwed up my mixture, causing it to start fast and fizzle quicker than it should. Right now, it looks like I might be less than 1 bubble per second, even with 2 bottles going.
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Post by Carl on Sept 28, 2011 15:53:14 GMT -5
I should note that the beauty of the design of a Filter Max is that it traps the CO2 inside the internal chamber until it eventually leeches into the water. This is especially important with the Jungle Fizz tabs since these do not last long at all (& thus is my biggest complaint with this product as the diffusion chamber supplied does not adequately trap the CO2 long enough for a slow dispersion into the aquarium). I tested again today about 3 hours after the Fizz tab dissolved, but while their was still CO2 swirling around in the chamber and the CO2 level was 20 ppm. Carl
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Post by babygeige on Sept 28, 2011 19:47:23 GMT -5
The CO2 kit that I bought a couple of years ago was a Hagen something or other. It has a nice little canister, which I still use. The CO2 bubbles were diffused into the water via a ladder-type thing. The CO2 started at the bottom and went up the ladder, old school Donkey Kong style. As it got to the top, you could actually see the bubbles get smaller. The problems I had with the ladder were: 1) It didn't look very nice in the tank, 2) It was a HUGE pain in the butt to clean and it accumulated algae pretty quickly in my tank, 3) at the time I had a snail problem in there and the snails were always crawling in the ladder I may try it again just to see if it makes a difference. I don't really remember very well.
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Post by parker002 on Sept 29, 2011 9:40:56 GMT -5
Some people swear by the Hagen ladder but in the end it isn't all that efficient. It's better than a bell but not nearly as good as a reactor.
The Hagen canister uses pre-mixed yeast and sugar, so it's basically a more expensive version of the DIY mix I'm using. The one advantage it does have is that the mixture is pre-measured so you should theoretically get a uniform and consistent performance from one batch to the next (precisely the problem I seem to be struggling with right now).
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Post by Carl on Sept 29, 2011 10:01:53 GMT -5
I personally (& a few friends) did not care for the Hagen System, in part just for reasons stated by babygeige. Although I did find the yeast packets convenient.
A thought is to try a DIY reactor/diffuser mated with your Hagen system?
Carl
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Post by parker002 on Sept 30, 2011 9:53:40 GMT -5
People using DIY reactors with the Red Sea/Hagen/Nutrafin kits have reported very good results.
Carl, I noticed you're using the Jungle Fizz tabs, doesn't that produce a CO2 spike?
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Post by Carl on Sept 30, 2011 18:23:25 GMT -5
Yes, that is the negative of the Jungle Fizz Tabs or similar method using Aerosol CO2 as well. However spike is not really the operative word, it is more that the CO2 begins to rise shortly after adding the Fizz Tab, but comes down slowly starting about 5-6 hours later and is down about 7-8 hours later and IMO this is plenty of CO2 exposure.
My friend uses this DIY Reactor with a CO2 canister with a regulator and a timer, so there is no issue at all other than his problem when first using this of not turning off the CO2 canister soon enough for it to work through the Reactor, with the result being too much CO2 after dark and almost killing a few prize Clown loaches.
Carl
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Post by parker002 on Sept 30, 2011 22:44:19 GMT -5
So I wonder if I could insert the Jungle mixing bottle straight into my feed line with a T, so that I can run both bottles AND the fizz tabs? I might try it to see what happens.
Also, I completely redesigned my reactor today. I will have to put a photo up tomorrow after I've had a chance to observe for a bit.
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Post by parker002 on Oct 8, 2011 11:58:57 GMT -5
I had to discontinue my use of DIY CO2. Inconsistent CO2 levels were contributing to a lot of staghorn and green spot algae. Plus, my hygro difformis was becoming unmanageable! Pics are here.
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Post by Carl on Oct 8, 2011 12:34:40 GMT -5
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