Angelic? Not really

[babygeige]

I noticed in the last week or 2 that something has been ruining my little black angels fins, particularly his anal fin. It's now half as long as it used to be. I mentioned it to my dad and he told me that he's seen the koi angel fish picking on the black one. (Thanks for not telling me, dad! )

Anyway, I'm not really sure what to do. I could move the black one to my 10 gallon so his fins can heal up, but I'll probably just have the same problem when I move him back. I'll probably have the same issue if I move the koi guy for a while too. The black one was there first before and it only took about a week or 2 for the koi to start picking on him.

[Carl]

Although this is an observation; I have noticed for many years (if not a couple decades), that black angels seem to be much weaker and almost always end up at the bottom of the pecking order, often resulting in exactly what you noted.

Another person that breeds angels professionally once told me that the black angel is a recessive trait and he suspects that this has something to do with this.

Carl

[babygeige]

That would make sense. He's definitely teeny and seems more delicate. I'm really surprised he survived the parasite problem. His body is only about as big as a nickel, while the koi angel is more of a quarter size, maybe a bit bigger.

I might move him to the 10 gallon for a while and at least give him a chance to recover.

[goldenpuon]

That is very small. Just curious but are both angelfish very young?

[babygeige]

They are pretty young. The lfs gets them from local breeders all the time. I don't know exactly how old they are though. Maybe someone who has raised them can give us a guess. I meant to ask at the lfs, but I always forgot and now they don't have any of them left.

Here's my plan. I'm gong to move the black one to the 10 gallon to heal and grow up a bit. When the koi one gets bigger, I'll move the big one I adopted to share the 50 gal with the koi. I'll put the black one in the 30 by himself so he won't get picked on. Not sure how fast they grow, so this might all take a while, lol.

[goldenpuon]

Thanks for the info. I would guess that they are pretty young sicne adults can grow 6 inches long and be 6 inches height-wise. But you never know.

Good luck with your angels! Hope the black one makes a full recovery!

[babygeige]

Thanks Renee! He seems to have settled in the 10 gallon pretty nicely. He's curious about the shrimp, but they won't let him get close enough to get a good look, lol. It's funny. The shrimp definitely know a threatening fish from a non-threatening one. They let the white clouds and CPD get right up to them without flinching, but the angel? Forget it!


I'm adding some Melafix to the water, so hopefully that will help his fins get better.
Here's a picture of him. You can see how bad his bottom fin is, the poor little guy!

[DaharkazAngel]

Aw he definately looks like a baby!! Hope he gets better. Ive never had this problem between my Angels but i have had other fish cause this issue. Is there anything else it could be, or who lol.

[babygeige]

The only other fish in there are some Colombian Tetras. They're pretty frisky, but mostly with each other. I had 4 in there at that time and the only fish I saw a tetra go after was another tetra. But you never know... I added 3 more tetras a couple of weeks ago to make sure any nippiness stays within the family.

I think this little guy's fin is slowly starting to get better. I've been treating with Mela or Pima fix, whichever one is for fin damage.
He likes to chase the shrimp around. It's funny!

[angelminx]

I never had much luck with my "black" (mostly-black marbles)angels either. I had some black lace zebras when I lived in California in the early '80s, and never had any problems with them; but then out there they had accesses to live brine shrimp on a regular basis, and I can't find any live food sources out here (Illinois). The "black" angels I've gotten out here are definitely weaker, although I had a pair once (one was mostly black-marble, the other closer to half-and-half) that I did have for quite a while. The female of this pair used to "terrorize" the bigger male as they started to grow up, but eventually they settled in together quite happily.

I've never really tried to raise the babies, but the 2nd-to-last time my present pair spawned they were free-swimming for a couple of days (as they slowly disappeared). I purchased some Ocean Nutrition Instant Baby Brine Shrimp so I'd be ready for the next time....then they barely made it past hatching. The pair hasn't laid eggs since, and it's been over 2 months.

The female of this pair is a gold angel, and her mate is a marble; I had a "black" male and silver veiltail female with them as well. Originally the silver was paired up with the marble male, but when the black male died, the gold angel ousted her and claimed the marble male for herself. She's been picking on the silver veiltail ever since, so I finally moved the (now half-)veiltail to the 10G quarantine tank where she can rest up and maybe regain her confidence. The gold angel has become very aggressive, and unless I'm feeding them, she will even attack me (or anything I put in the tank--like the dropper I use for water testing, etc.), and even sometimes break the surface trying to get at whatever. I hate to break the pair up, but I'm wondering if I should try that, and put the silver back in the 55G. If I do, I don't know if I should try to exchange her for another fish (if Petsmart or Petco will even do that--I asked Petsmart once quite a while ago about exchanging fish if there was a problem, but they weren't too possitive about doing that).

I took some pictures a while ago (the 1st couple of times I tried, the gold angel freaked out) that are in a "series"; there are some different placements in the tank in the succession of pics, because when I got the fish centered/in focus, by the time the picture was actually taken the fish had/or was starting to move. Gerrie, the gold angel, kept threatening the camera, and I had to delete quite a few because she got too close, and about all you could see was a blur of gold. I'll try to post them, but I can only post 3 at a time. I have to go to the regular reply section 1st, because I'm on the Quick Reply right now.

[angelminx]

Here are the 1st 3 pics:    

[angelminx]

And the next 3:   

[angelminx]

The last 3 (like I said, the "close-ups" got deleted--I wish I knew haw to make these post at a larger size):

   

[angelminx]

Here are three more pics (I'm still figuring this attatchment thing out):
 
showing Gerrie,

her mate Angelminx (named him before I knew he was a male),

and one with Angelminx with Munkustrap (named at same age as the others) in the specimin container I used to medicate her--here she's just in it so I could get a picture.

[devonjohnsgard]

I have a pure black angel I got from a local breeder and really he is the one of the kings of the tank. I even have a tiger gourami in the tank that picks on everyone, but the angel. He is one of the bigger fish, so I'm sure that has something to do with it. You can check him out on my tank build thread, but he's much bigger now. I need to get some updated pictures up.

[babygeige]

Nice pics, angelminx! I ended up losing that little black angel. I've only got one angel fish now, Pierre. This post was shortly after I started my big tank. I probably lost 7 angels to some sort of parasite or something and Pierre was the only one to make it!

[devonjohnsgard]

That would be sad to lose so many...If you want them grow, they turn into part of the family.