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Post by kagome on Apr 28, 2009 18:33:56 GMT -5
My husband is wanting to set up a 55g for SA cichlids this fall. He wants to recreate a tank he had when he lived in West Virginia and had to give up when he moved to Florida. In it he made a network of rock caves and driftwood, which he plans to make again. For stock it had a Jack Dempsey, a Red Devil, a Green Terror, and a Pearl Scale. He kept this mix successfully for about five years but when it came time to move, the tank and everyone in it were just too big to bring down here, ok, well actually, his ex-wife just didn't want to go through the hassle so he only got to bring down the one tank, but that's another story. What do ya'll think about this mix?
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Post by murdock6701 on Apr 28, 2009 18:39:30 GMT -5
sounds like he likes aggressive fish to me.....not that it's bad, but not speaking from experience, jut reading, has lead me to reply as I did - hope no offense is taken
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Post by eve on Apr 28, 2009 19:12:59 GMT -5
i would say as long as he buys them all as juveniles and all at the same time it might work out again
but as we all know, what works for one, might not work for another
or what works once, might not work again
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Post by bikeguy33 on Apr 28, 2009 19:24:31 GMT -5
IMO....all these fish are FAR to aggressive to be togeather. as juvies they may get along but it is risky....especially the green terror and the JD. i have seen this combo done lots and eventually one will always lose its lips. the red terror is no slouch either. as well....for these breeds a 55 gallon is FAR to small. fish this size will need at least 200 or more gallons...
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Post by brenda on Apr 28, 2009 19:26:09 GMT -5
It may work but just because it worked once before doesn't mean it will again. I have never kept a red devil but most people I know who have them have them in a tank by themselves and I am talking like a 75 gallon. I am not sure what a pearl scale is but the dempsey and terror should be ok but once again it just depend on the individual fishes personality. It would probably work for a while and maybe for life but I can't guarantee it.
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Post by brenda on Apr 28, 2009 19:27:28 GMT -5
IMO....all these fish are FAR to aggressive to be togeather. as juvies they may get along but it is risky....especially the green terror and the JD. i have seen this combo done lots and eventually one will always lose its lips. the red terror is no slouch either. as well....for these breeds a 55 gallon is FAR to small. fish this size will need at least 200 or more gallons... You have found the opposite issue....I have generally found the dempsey and terror to work...It just goes to show it is a crap shoot. lol
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Post by bikeguy33 on Apr 28, 2009 19:40:54 GMT -5
i have a video of a friends tank somewhere on my comp. the jd and terror lip locked....within 15 seconds there was extensive damage to bot....the terrors had to go. this is the worst i have seen....but have seen it in other tanks and there are many videos of those 2 species on youtube as well in the thrawls of battle
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Post by Carl on Apr 28, 2009 20:43:58 GMT -5
I have kept many SA tanks over the years (the Bahooka Restaurant has dozens alone), & honestly kagome I am surprised it worked for much time
All these fish are aggressive in their own right, I knew the Pearl Scale as a Blue Texas Cichlid (Herichthys carpintis) with a similar personality to a Texas Cichlid.
As Brenda stated it is a crap shoot, but from my experience almost all of these tanks would end up as a Red Devil only tank, in fact I later did not sell Red Devils in my store because they invariably would be returned (as would Pacus).
Carl
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Post by brenda on Apr 28, 2009 20:58:09 GMT -5
Well Carl, it seems we both agree on the red devil.
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Post by kagome on Apr 28, 2009 21:16:08 GMT -5
I don't know how he managed to make it work before other than he said he bought them all a juvies and they grew up together. Personally, all I really want are the Dempseys and maybe the Pearlscales, but I think they are too similar to tolerate each other. The red devil is just too big. What's driving me nuts is when I look all of these up and look at compatibility all they say is "other SA cichlids". A green severum is an SA cichlid, and if you put it in a tank with a tank with any of these it would be torn to shreds.
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Post by bikeguy33 on Apr 28, 2009 22:06:08 GMT -5
even in that case....a jd will grow to around a foot...a 55 is too small unless the fish gets traded in when it gets too big....
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Post by kagome on Apr 29, 2009 0:28:40 GMT -5
Ok, I majorly feel like a horse's behind, but I screwed up and so have to admit it. My husband and I had been talking about getting a 55g in the fall and that since the 10g and 38g are mine that the 55g would be his to do with as he pleased. When he went to out the door this afternoon to go to work he mentioned in passing that he wanted to recreate his old SA tank he had in WV and said we would discuss it further when he got home. When he came home tonight I asked him about his SA tank that he used to have. I mentioned that his idea about the fish didn't seem like it would work, even though it had worked for him in the past. He turned and said, "What combination of fish, we hadn't even discussed fish beyond it being a South American tank?" To which I replied, "The one you had with the Green Terror, the Red Devil, the Jack Dempsey, and the Pearlscale in it." He laughed and said, "I was just talking about the rock caves I had in the 55g, I never had those fish together, that would be crazy, it was Robbie who tried that crazy idea in his 125g. I set up the caves in that tank for him but it was his idea to put the fish in it." (Robbie was one of his best friends in WV) I was feeling pretty stupid at this point, I said "I thought you said you bought all these fish as juveniles and they grew up together and you had them for five years until you moved down here and that everything went fine with it." At this he really laughed hard and told me that indeed Robbie had done this and that it had worked for a little while until the fish started to mature, so I asked him what happened and he said, "The Green Terror killed the Dempsey and the Pearlscale and then the Red Devil killed the Green Terror and then two days later the Red Devil died and Robbie bought severums." So I am really embarrassed that I got these two stories mixed up, when he said he wanted to recreate his old SA tank, he was talking about the rock caves and I thought he meant this mix of cichlids which apparently weren't even his. He did at one time own all four of these species but they were kept in separate aquariums. So, um yeah...my bad, my husband was not suggesting we put the most homicidal group of SA cichlids together in one tank and I jumped the gun and now I feel really dumb, please forgive me.
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Post by barbara on Apr 29, 2009 0:30:47 GMT -5
Misunderstandings happen, and this was a learning experience for me. I have no experience with SA cichlids, and this taught me a few things. Please don't feel dumb, it was one of those things.
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Post by Carl on Apr 29, 2009 9:01:26 GMT -5
OK, this also makes me wonder what kind of "drugs" he had these fish on, as I never had any of these fish live much past juveniles together before aggression set in (especially the Red Devils). ;D
Carl
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Post by bikeguy33 on Apr 29, 2009 10:11:46 GMT -5
Well I for one am glad this was a misunderstanding.....lol. all these species are beautiful and filled with personalities. my LFS doesnt even keep these species tanks side by side. they said they often injure themselves running into the glass. I will say tho....what an entertaining story...
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Post by murdock6701 on Apr 29, 2009 11:38:43 GMT -5
WHEW! glad that episode id over.......I could sense a disaster in the making
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Post by kagome on Apr 29, 2009 21:39:18 GMT -5
Yeah, I feel pretty dumb about this. I got all mixed up because he has always told me stories about these fish and stuff they would do. I just got it wrong that he had them all in their own tanks and it was his friend Robbie who tried putting them together.
OMG, now he is saying that he wants to get a 110g, skip the rock caves, and have discus.
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Post by jonv on Apr 29, 2009 21:49:10 GMT -5
Kagome, something like this, I wouldn't feel dumb about. I don't think you should. If I might point out some overlooked facts here? YOu actually had the memory of the stock, even if it wasn't your husband that did it, you did remember what was in the tank. Take some credit for knowing what was in the tank there. That's a good memory. Take credit as well that you posted and asked about this, before actually just doing it. That's really the thing I often see in posts on cichild specific places, someone will talk about a tank with this and that in it, and you sit there and wonder, why did you do that? They just listened to the LFS or whatever and followed what they got told, instead of asking around. Don't beat yourself up too much. I'd actually blogged up an answer for you while I'd been pending if I wanted to answer anything outside of my own threads, but I think if you are feeling bad about things, that you really shouldn't becasue I see the good of what you did, to ask and get opinions from the expereienced before just doing it. I know JD's and GT's are often talked about in YA and MFK. They are a nice looking South American fish. My Nimbochromis Venustus has his moment as well, but smaller fish are terrified of him and his big mouth. Popular fish aren't wrong to want, but you have to plan around the footprint. Like what bikeguy had said, the overall sizes really inhibit the whole stock in a tank of that size. If you say something like 210 or 250, I actually think that would work out. Though what the part you cannot control, would be the genders. If they all turned out male, even that 250 might turn out too small, because the mid sets of these species are basically, "Whatever I see is mine" aka very non community types. If just for some cosmic reason a tank like that did get set up though, I'd bet a paycheck on the Red Devil being last standing, all fish being equal. Glad you asked and didn't just do. THere is a LFS 40 mins from me I personally have bought from in the past, I could probably get you some discounted prices on if you really want SA's. www.tangledupincichlids.com/Jeff Rapps knows me, I've bought Madagascars from him, but he's got a HUGE stock of both SA and CA's, so if you want to plan out a different mix, I'll try to get you a discounted price by ordering myself and making it a bulk order. It's even worth nothing, that Vieja Synispilium bikeguy was keeping, he's also got various sizes of those too, at pretty reasonable prices. If you're looking for a SA or CA fish, this is your place to look.
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Post by barbara on Apr 30, 2009 7:19:51 GMT -5
Wow, discus, really? I'd love that, but the water perimeters here in San Antonio would require a R/O system, and since most of my fish are hard water lovers, I'd have a hard time justifying that purchase. Maybe someday...but I don't know. I really enjoy the kinds of things I am stocking now, and the sensitivity of discus may be too much of a challenge for me.
Is that just a dream, or is that something he's serious about?
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Post by Carl on Apr 30, 2009 10:09:02 GMT -5
Discus were and still are my favorite Fish, in fact Amazon River tanks in general. My favorite tank I maintained was one I set up with a more hands on client of mine. It was a 280 gallon aquarium with double drilled filters, a UV and many plants. We had many discus, G. rams, cardinals, festivums and more. Boy I really miss this tank. The link you posted Jon had one of my favorite SA cichlids (not as much as discus though) that I do not read or hear much about anymore; the Uaru Cichlid. I am curious as to why these guys are not that popular. Carl
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