Sponge Filter Question

[csa1961]

Hi .. I’m running two # 2 hydro sponge filters. One is about 7 months old and the other is 4 months old. Cleaning the older, more established filter a couple weeks ago, I squeezed out a ton of gunk (dirty water in bucket). For the newer sponge, this is my second rinse .. been just over 4 weeks since the first rinse (then was mildly dirty, but only 10 weeks into its seeding) and I had dirty water, but not that bad at all. This second rinse barely stained the water. So I’m curious.. is that normal? Maybe cleaning too soon? The other, more established sponge doing most of the work? It seems perfectly fine other than that. Still looks newish. My nitrates are high now, but i think that may be because of the Bacteria AE I’m using for the cherry shrimp. I will cut down on that drastically. I also have some leaf litter in the tank and driftwood. I took out the big piece to allow better vacuuming. Ammonia and Nitrite are 0. Sorry for the long ramble ... Any thoughts would be appreciated.

[Carl]

Hi & welcome to EA!

Could you supply a picture of your aquarium including placement relative to everything?

This one filter may be in an area that does not pick up the DOC as well., it also might be simply age (I've found the sponge itself attracts debris better as it ages)

You also might try extending the air line deeper inside the sponge itself, well past the bulls eye

Carl

[csa1961]

Carl,

Thanks for the reply. I do use a diffuser that AAP sells. I added some tubing to lower it even further down the tube, to help increase the lift. I will add a pic, but it’s a 10 gallon with one #2 Hydro Sponge filter in each back corner. Pretty simple set up. My nitrates are likely high for a few reasons, but could be mainly because of my exploding cherry shrimp population. I’ve been giving them away to my local aquarium shop (fish store). I’m leaning towards the fact that it’s a newer sponge than the other one, like you said. But its location wouldn’t seem to be an issue.

[Carl]

I would agree with your further explanation that location is likely not the issue.

More likely the fact it is a newer less "broken in" sponge

Carl

[Carl]

I would also suggest cutting back on the "Bacter AE Micro Powder"

Ingredients
Amino acids, polysaccarides, xylanase, glucanase, amylase, protease, hemicellulase, Bacillus subtilis, Pediococcus acidilactici (Lactobacillus)
aquaticarts.com/products/glasgarten-bacter-ae

While in theory this seems like an excellent product the bacterium "Lactobacillus" is a known problematic bacteria when even in the gut where it belongs. Added directly to the tank I can see it quite the breeder of excess organics

Carl

[csa1961]

Carl,

I agree .. I been using it at the recommended amount for a couple months now. I’ve never been over 20-30PPM nitrates until now. I will cut the dose in half, but stop feeding it for a week or two. They were doing good without it, but i did notice a baby explosion with it. There is plenty for them to eat with the leaves and algae tabs or spinach (mainly for the otto’s) every few days.

Currently have three Rasboras, two Getrudae Rainbows, and two Otto’s. And too many cherry shrimp .. time to re-Home more .. again. Seems every six weeks I have to give away 30-40 !!

[Carl]

May 5, 2018 11:37:24 GMT -5 csa1961 said:

Carl,

I agree .. I been using it at the recommended amount for a couple months now. I’ve never been over 20-30PPM nitrates until now. I will cut the dose in half, but stop feeding it for a week or two. They were doing good without it, but i did notice a baby explosion with it. There is plenty for them to eat with the leaves and algae tabs or spinach (mainly for the otto’s) every few days.

Definitely some science behind its use as your baby explosion can attest to. But with many products there are also some negatives, so finding balance is the key!

Carl

[csa1961]

Hey Carl .. like many if not most aquariums, I have Detritus worms. I see them floating in the water, especially when I refill after a vacuum and water change. I know they don’t harm things, and actually can do good .. like earthworms. However too many can be a sign of higher Nitrates. Mine are at 30 now, after a few water change and a good vacuuming. BUT .. I keep seeing them in the water just a few at a time. The fish love them and eat them readily .. what had/has me puzzled is why they are in the water, and not in the gravel .. then it struck me as I looked closer at the sponge filter. They are in the sponge (outside and presumably inside) .. and as they get closer to the center, they get sucked up and out, spiraling in the water from the surface.

Question: could they effect the biological filtration performance of the sponge filter? Would they be consuming good bacteria?

[Carl]

I've not observed any changes in bio filtration with Sponge Filters or similar bio filters in aquariums with large numbers of Detritus Worms.
Detritus Worms are composting at a "higher level" than the nitrifying bacteria.

This said, since Detrutus Worms compost larger debris that might show up in a sponge filter, this could at least in theory slow down accumulation of organics you would observe in rinsing of the sponges

Carl

[csa1961]

Just cleaned the sponge filter (in declorinated tap water) after 5 weeks since this post. Water was barely dirty. Cleaned the other sponge filter last week, after 6 weeks, and it was fairly dirty. Still stumped why the one sponge, albeit newer, is barely getting dirty. Is this telling me I don’t need two .. that seems implausible however.

[devonjohnsgard]

Are the sponges set up the same way? Getting the same amount of airflow? Any other flow in the tank? Is the food being fed one side of the tank?

[csa1961]

They are in a 10 gallon tank. One in each back corner. Same pumps on each one. Feed in the middle of the tank. The one that isn’t hardly dirty was a new sponge on 1/20/18. It should be well seasoned by now for sure. Th other sponge was new on 10/01/17 .. so 8 months old. I’ve done a lot of heavy vacuuming lately and removed some gravel to make it easier to keep clean. Nitrates are down to <20. Three Rassboras, three Otto’s, two Getrudae Rainbows and approximately 50 smallish Bloody Mary shrimp (many juveniles). Ammonia and Nitrite both 0ppm.

I can’t see any reason for it. It has good flow, although with that one i do have it on the pedestal .. so the bottom of the foam is farther from the gravel by about an inch or so.

[Carl]

Jun 11, 2018 13:00:23 GMT -5 csa1961 said:

although with that one i do have it on the pedestal .. so the bottom of the foam is farther from the gravel by about an inch or so.

This may & does make the difference (I have a small 15 gallon with two #2 Filters and the one without the "pedestal" gets twice as dirty twice as fast), as well one that is well established will act more as a magnet for debris, I've seen that many time

Carl

[csa1961]

Thanks, Carl. I’ll remove the pedestal and add a longer riser tube. That combo (like the other filter) may be the ticket. At least it may help.

[mcr]

Just curious, does it matter if one picks up more junk than the other? Wouldn’t they still have the good bacteria? You could just clean the one more often than the other?

[Carl]

Dec 12, 2018 1:23:30 GMT -5 mcr said:

Just curious, does it matter if one picks up more junk than the other? Wouldn’t they still have the good bacteria? You could just clean the one more often than the other?

This is a good question.
The ability to trap "junk" is also a symptom of how much bacterial bio capacity the can handle. In my tests years back, those that could hold more generally had a higher bio capacity.

Carl

[devonjohnsgard]

Dec 12, 2018 1:23:30 GMT -5 mcr said:

Just curious, does it matter if one picks up more junk than the other? Wouldn’t they still have the good bacteria? You could just clean the one more often than the other?

Holding more just means the filter can handle more load or larger issues if there are any... like an over feeding.

[mcr]

That’s good to know about the sponge filters. Thanks