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Post by devonjohnsgard on Mar 28, 2015 9:45:51 GMT -5
very nice. Your able to open it up easily to put sand in and maintenance?
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Post by sdboers on Mar 28, 2015 11:11:13 GMT -5
Yes - the top screws right off to add / remove sand. I'll try and shoot a video of that later on. Here is the test! First off - here is the fully assembled FSB with the downspout installed: I put about 2" of the ceramic media in the bottom instead of rocks: Then I added about 6" of sand on top of that: And here is a picture of it running: And finally - here is a video of it running... A few points: 1) Some of the ceramic media stays nicely at the bottom (the heavier stuff with the holes). Some of it is floating around (the lighter stuff with no center hole). I'll have to pick through and remove the lighter stuff! 2) This is running with a MagDrive 950 on full flow. I think for full operation, when the sand gets heavier, I might need something with a little more flow than that! yikes! 3) You'll notice in the video that I started and stopped it. I think the ceramic media keeps the sand from settling enough to cover the holes at the bottom and keep it from restarting. 4) I think this is gonna work!! Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Mar 29, 2015 6:33:27 GMT -5
Hey Folks, So I played around with this a bit last night and I think I have it fairly well set-up now... I made some minor adjustments as follows:
1) I removed the lighter ceramic media that was floating around with the sand, leaving only the heavier ceramic tube media that stays at the bottom. I also tried it with only sand - which worked great except for stopping and starting. The sand packed too heavily around the holes and the pump couldn't get it all moving again. Back to the media... 2) I increased the amount of sand by a couple inches. The fact that it didn't fluidize to the top of the tube wasn't a flow problem - it just needed more sand.
You'll see now that it fluidizes just a little too much - right up into the white part at the lid. I will be installing a ball valve so I can adjust the pressure.
Here is a video of the adjusted results. I have to say - I'm thrilled with the outcome. Thanks everyone for your ideas and assistance!
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Post by Carl on Mar 29, 2015 11:35:54 GMT -5
Excellent Job! Congrats! Carl
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Post by devonjohnsgard on Mar 30, 2015 8:55:57 GMT -5
Once that sand starts to gather bacteria, the sand will actually float differently. You'll need even less flow then.
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Post by angelminx on Mar 30, 2015 15:51:00 GMT -5
Great job! [The dog sure had an opinion !] Does anyone know how the energy consumption on that kind of filter compare to other filters? Normally I wouldn't think about that, but recently ( at least the last year) my electric usage seems to have gone up ~ twice as much as it has been in the past. I know I occasionally do stupid thins like forget to turn off the oven/burners, or leave the TV/computer on while doing something else and getting sidetracked, but I didn't think that that, or adding a UV sterilizer and running 2 filters (instead of one) per tank, should cause that big of a jump in electric usage-- and I'm using LEDs now instead of the 2 48" T8 fluorescent bulbs on my 55G. I did add a cheap Marineland LED for the 10G, when I didn't have any light on it before.
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Post by Carl on Mar 30, 2015 19:16:39 GMT -5
Great job! [The dog sure had an opinion !] Does anyone know how the energy consumption on that kind of filter compare to other filters? Normally I wouldn't think about that, but recently ( at least the last year) my electric usage seems to have gone up ~ twice as much as it has been in the past. I know I occasionally do stupid thins like forget to turn off the oven/burners, or leave the TV/computer on while doing something else and getting sidetracked, but I didn't think that that, or adding a UV sterilizer and running 2 filters (instead of one) per tank, should cause that big of a jump in electric usage-- and I'm using LEDs now instead of the 2 48" T8 fluorescent bulbs on my 55G. I did add a cheap Marineland LED for the 10G, when I didn't have any light on it before. The energy usage depends upon the pump being used to run it. As an example, a Rio 1100 pump which is commonly used for FSB filters, uses 23 watts Resource: www.americanaquariumproducts.com/RioPlusPumps.htmlCarl
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Post by sdboers on Mar 31, 2015 11:11:50 GMT -5
Once that sand starts to gather bacteria, the sand will actually float differently. You'll need even less flow then. Interesting. I had assumed that as the sand gathered bacteria, that I would need more flow to keep it fluidized. Thanks for that - good to know. Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Mar 31, 2015 11:29:49 GMT -5
Great job! [The dog sure had an opinion !] Does anyone know how the energy consumption on that kind of filter compare to other filters? Normally I wouldn't think about that, but recently ( at least the last year) my electric usage seems to have gone up ~ twice as much as it has been in the past. I know I occasionally do stupid thins like forget to turn off the oven/burners, or leave the TV/computer on while doing something else and getting sidetracked, but I didn't think that that, or adding a UV sterilizer and running 2 filters (instead of one) per tank, should cause that big of a jump in electric usage-- and I'm using LEDs now instead of the 2 48" T8 fluorescent bulbs on my 55G. I did add a cheap Marineland LED for the 10G, when I didn't have any light on it before. The dogs *always* have some kind of an opinion to share! lol... The dog who chimed in on my commentary was "Maverick". You can see him here: www.birchhaven.org/archives/category/adoption/maverick I'm not sure I can adequately answer your energy consumption question, but let me put down some details and thoughts... My 135g tank currently runs two Eheim Pro II (2028) filters. From the specs - these pull 25 watts each. I also run 2 maxijet 1200s for circulation - these pull about 20 watts each. So my filtration and circulation is running about 90 watts total. Unimpeded - this whole combination would supply about 900 gph of circulation, less when the filters get plugged up. Since I am running my shiny new FSB with a magdrive 950 - this alone pulls about 93 watts. I would hypothesize that it has significantly more bio-filtration capacity than the two Eheims combined (can someone confirm?). Circulation wise, the pump is putting out about the same 900 gph of circulation. Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Mar 31, 2015 11:40:17 GMT -5
I have a question for people - interested in your opinions...
The FSB I built in this thread is about 28 inches high - tip to tip. I cut the clear tube at 24", the rest is tacked on with the white caps at each end in the picture. I put about 2" of ceramic media in the bottom, and about 7" of pool filter sand on top of that. That provides a volume of about 88 cubic inches of sand for the fluidized bed part.
The tube I purchased actually comes in a 36" length. Is there any value in simply building the FSB at 36", or is this just a crazy height with no real benefit for a 135g tank? The only real addition to the cost would be in the size of the pump required to create enough flow. All the other materials are the same, except maybe 50 cents more worth of sand...
Thoughts?
Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Mar 31, 2015 12:29:12 GMT -5
I have another question... Carl? You around? How do I calculate the bio-load capacity of this FSB? As a comparison point - the TMC 1500 states a 395 gallon tank, or 30 pounds of fish. The one I built is both taller and slightly wider. Does this translate directly into a larger bio-capacity? Inquiring minds want to know... Sean.
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Post by Carl on Mar 31, 2015 14:38:38 GMT -5
The bio capacity is determined by the amount of sand, assuming your FSB chamber can properly fluidize said amount used. Basically this is 1/2 kg of sand per 4.5 kg (10 lbs) of bio load
You can make this filter as high as you want. The higher the more bio capacity, including more de-nitrifying potential.
I have seen FSB Filter over 3 meter high, but these were also much wider so as to keep the filter more aerobic (which is the primary bio filtration)
Carl
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Post by sdboers on Apr 5, 2015 7:46:53 GMT -5
Hey folks, So I'm about to get a real lesson on how well my FSB is going to work out. I had put my 2 Eheim canisters up on Kijiji for sale not expecting them to move any time quickly... Well... Thanks to an early morning power outage, a guy in the area lost his filter and needed a replacement quickly. Eheims exit stage left, FSB enters stage right. I figure that worst case scenario - as it ramps up - I can crank open my automatic water change to a higher flow rate if the levels start to get out of whack. My continuous water change will run up to 16 gallons an hour if needed. I had already put the cycled ceramic rings in the bottom and was running it casually on the tank. Now it is the only source of filtration! Eeek. I'll be constructing a proper spray bar return for it later this week, rather than just the hose stuffed in the tank. I also took the opportunity to weigh out the sand that was in there - just over 2kgs. So with Carl's info above, this one FSB should handle a pretty hefty bio-load. Still plan to build a second for this tank and run them in pairs. I'll let you know how this filter handles the load as the only source of filtration. Sean.
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Post by angelminx on Apr 5, 2015 14:02:33 GMT -5
Good luck...but it sounds like you don't need it
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Post by sdboers on Apr 6, 2015 9:49:22 GMT -5
I have a question...
My FSB seems to be *producing* bubbles. Not a lot - but enough that it collects at the top, and then gets shunted out the return flow. I'm certain it is produced inside the FSB as no air is being fed to it. With the entire thing having water pushed through it (pump is submersed) - it's not possible for air to leak in - only water to leak out...
So my question is - what's going on? Is this gas being produced as a result of the biological activity already?
Sean.
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Post by Carl on Apr 6, 2015 11:23:42 GMT -5
The only thing that would produce gas is hydrogen sulfate production, which not only is this too soon, but simply cannot happen with this much water movement Reference: www.aquarium-pond-answers.com/2008/11/hydrogen-sulfides.htmlLikely air is entering somewhere and is being moved into the chamber Sources include: *Air diffuser near the water pump. *Leak somewhere in the lines *The base seal has a small leak Carl
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Post by Carl on Apr 6, 2015 11:23:51 GMT -5
The only thing that would produce gas is hydrogen sulfate production, which not only is this too soon, but simply cannot happen with this much water movement Reference: www.aquarium-pond-answers.com/2008/11/hydrogen-sulfides.htmlLikely air is entering somewhere and is being moved into the chamber Sources include: *Air diffuser near the water pump. *Leak somewhere in the lines *The base seal has a small leak Carl
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Post by sdboers on Apr 6, 2015 12:37:30 GMT -5
Hmmm... I will have to investigate further. Given that everything after the pump would be under at least some pressure from the inside, I have a hard time figuring out how any air could possibly seep in. Any miniscule hole would eventually seep water out - not let air in. I will watch the intake more closely and see if anything could be getting drawn in to the system from the tank. The plot thickens... Incidentally - after one full day - ammonia is still under 0.1 and nitrite is still 0. Will continue monitoring as there is a heavy bio load in this tank for a new filter. Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Apr 6, 2015 19:24:18 GMT -5
Ok - those readings were from last night after a full day. As of tonight - the readings are as follows: Ammonia: 0.3 Nitrite: at least 4.0 to 5.0 ppm - dangerously high I have cranked open my continuous water change to lower those levels. On the upside? I know the filter is cycling or I wouldn't have nitrites... Go FSB! Sean.
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Post by sdboers on Apr 17, 2015 8:48:36 GMT -5
Time to report back on the progress. FSB has been running for about 2 weeks now as the only source of biological filtration. - Ammonia is running close enough to 0ppm to consider that portion fully cycled
- Nitrite is still above 0 at between 0.5 and 1.0 ppm. As such - I still have the continuous water change flowing fairly quickly.
- Nitrates not bad at around 20ppm
The sand in the FSB is changing colour as well - with a clear difference in colour between the top and bottom. The bottom layers have darkened, but remain gray in colour. The upper layers have become more of a dark brownish colour. See below:
All said - the tank is still looking really nice and clear:
Sean.
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