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Post by brenda on Oct 9, 2008 18:40:56 GMT -5
I am looking for help on an issue...I have 5 female flamebacks but one has pinkish/reddish coloring on her head. I am trying to find out if this is normal or maybe this is actually a male I didn't know I had. I would think though if it were a male wouldn't it have more color or could it be young enough that it is just starting to color? I also thought if it were a male wouldn't it have colored up sooner after the loss of my other male? I know not many people have experience with these guys but...   |
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Post by Carl on Oct 9, 2008 19:31:40 GMT -5
This is a question I wish I could help you with, but maybe Jon V, John/8 or Bill may help.
I agree with your hypothesis, but that is not much help to you.
Carl
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Post by bikeguy33 on Oct 9, 2008 20:30:44 GMT -5
if it is a male it is very sub dominant. i know lil about this species, but it is a cichlid. watch behavior and feeding and of course look for egg spots. how old are these guys?  |
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Post by brenda on Oct 9, 2008 20:33:48 GMT -5
I don't know how old they are...they are only about 2". There are no other males of this species in the tank. I am trying to find someone who knows these guys to see if females ever get this coloring.
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Post by jonv on Oct 9, 2008 21:33:31 GMT -5
It's not unusual to see some females have SOME coloring like a male, and as you already know too, sub dominant males can sometimes look like a female as well. I have seen a male go so far as to act like a female to a dominant male and chase the tail to imitate spawning. I have a feeling in some males, you do what you can to not be a target.
I'm not sure the logic on why a female might appear male though. When I had my trio of Flavus, it took many months for me to know for sure the she was a she too. If it stays just a little bit of color, then it's either a sub dom like Bill said, or you just happen to have a rather colorful female is all. In the end, if you find eggs in the mouth, there's really no question about that, or of you see that one doing the tail wagging, you know you have a male. Outside of that, you could try to vent them I suppose.
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Post by brenda on Oct 15, 2008 9:22:07 GMT -5
Well, I am 99% sure this is a male as I have a female now holding and it couldn't have been anyone else. I have talked to some people including the guy who I got my new 4 flamebacks from and he said sometimes with these guys if there is no other male competition they can be lazy and not color up. I have also heard that from a nother guy who knows these fish. I am still worried if this could possibly be a hybrid...I think if the female is still holding in another week or so I will move her and wait and see how the babies turn out. no one seemed to think he is a hybrid so I guess that is good but I want to make sure. Hopefully I get a male out of my new ones so I can see if he will color up more with another male in the tank.
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Post by 8 in the Corner on Oct 15, 2008 11:29:47 GMT -5
Sometimes a female will color up to look like a sub-dominant male so the other females will not harrass her as they do with holding females on occasion.
As small as your fish are, it is doubtful that it is a holding female and more probably a male just starting to realize he is a male.
John
BTW, speaking of holding females being harrassed, did you know there are 24 species of fish in Lake Victoria (all of the cichlids in Victoria are mouthbrooders) that feed on the eggs/fry held by female mouthbrooders (these predators are called pedophages or "child-eaters"). Some have an oversized mouth with large lips and will attack and grab the female by the mouth from the front and actually suck the eggs/fry right out of her mouth. Others are called "rammers" and will batter the female from above and below so she spits out her brood.
8
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Post by brenda on Oct 15, 2008 11:50:04 GMT -5
Wow , That is crazy!!! Very interesting though. Thanks!!! I'll have to look more into that.
The fish pictured that is starting to color I do agree is a male..The female I have holding is not the one pictured but a different one and that is why I decided this must be a male.
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Post by Carl on Oct 15, 2008 20:03:33 GMT -5
That is interesting John, I did not know this! Thanks for the education!  Carl |
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Post by jonv on Oct 17, 2008 22:25:23 GMT -5
Yes I agree too and great point there John. Very interesting to know and I have to wonder if this along with the degradation of the lake itself enviromentally doesn't play a major role in most Victorians going endangered. That catfish that deceives mouth brooding females into holding their eggs instead I think is from Tangyangika right?
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Post by 8 in the Corner on Oct 20, 2008 13:02:23 GMT -5
Yes I agree too and great point there John. Very interesting to know and I have to wonder if this along with the degradation of the lake itself enviromentally doesn't play a major role in most Victorians going endangered. That catfish that deceives mouth brooding females into holding their eggs instead I think is from Tangyangika right?
Here is a good article and a great video on this very subject:
www.cichlid-forum.com/images/tab1.jpg
The catfish fry hatch earlier than the cichlids and will actually eat the unhatched cichlid eggs right in the mouth of the mother. Biologists have found dead female cichlids where the catfish fry have grown so quickly that sometimes the female cannot spit them out and dies of starvation with them still in her mouth.
John |
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